(BY BERNARD D. NOSSITER)

LONDON. -- THE ECOLYPTICS WHO WERE PREDICTING DISASTER IN A WORLD BEREFT OF COPPER, TIN, OIL AND OTHER SUPPOSEDLY EXHAUSTIBLE RESOURCES HAVE LOST THEIR CENTER STATE POSITION. FASHIONS IN CRISES CHANGE. PEOPLE WORRIED ABOUT MAINTAINING LAST YEAR'S LIVING STANDARDS IN INFLATION-RIDDEN SOCIETIES ARE NOT VERY RECEPTIVE TO PRESCRIPTIONS FOR PLANNED SLOWDOWN IN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.

BUT IF THE CLUB OF ROME AND OTHER ECODOOMSTERS RENEW THEIR CAMPAIGN, THE WORRIED CAN DERIVE SOME GENUINE SOLACE FROM A THOUGHTFLUL STUDY JUST PUBLISHED HERE, WILFRED BECKERMAN'S "IN DEFENSE OF ECONOMIC GROWTH."

THE PLAIN AND UNEXCITING FACT, BECKERMAN REPORTS, IS THAT USED UP RESOURCES ARE NOT LIKELY TO TROUBLE ANYONE FOR 100 MILLION YEARS OR SO, IF THEN. "RESOURCES ARE NOT REALLY FINITE IN ANY MEANINGFUL SENSE," HE SAYS.

BECKERMAN IS A DISTINGUISHED ECONOMIST AT THE UNIVERSITY OF LONDON (HE HOLDS THE CHAIR ONCE OCCUPIED BY STANLEY JEVONS, THE FOUNDER OF MARGINAL UTILITY). GIVEN HIS CRAFT'S DEVOTION TO ECONOMIC GROWTH, BECKERMAN WILL NO DOUBT BE ACCUSED OF SPECIAL PLEADING.

ECONOMISTS, MOREOVER, ARE NOT IN VERY GOOD STANDING THESE DAYS. THEY ARE UNABLE TO DECIDE WHETHER THE INDUSTRIALIZED WORLD NEEDS TO REFLATE AGAINST A THREATENED DEPRESSION OR DEFLATE TO PULL DOWN PRICES.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 013 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107107

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BUT ECONOMISTS DO HAVE ONE ADVANTAGE. THEY HAVE HEARD DOOM-LADEN FORECASTS BEFORE, FROM THE REV. MALTHUS AMONG OTHERS, AND WATCHED THEM EXPLODE UNDER THE IMPACT OF TECHNOLOGY. MOST IMPORTANTLY, ECONOMISTS, UNLIKE DOOMSTERS, KNOW ABOUT THE DYNAMIC QUALITY OF REPORTED RESERVES OF ANY MATERIAL.

BECKERMAN RECALLS A STUDY MADE IN 1944 THAT PREDICTED THE UNITED STATES WOULD RUN OUT OF TIN, NICKEL, ZINC, LEAD AND MANGANESE BY LAST YEAR. IT DIDN'T HAPPEN.

IN 1945, KNOWN COPPER RESERVES WERE 100 MILLION TONS. SINCE THEN, 93 MILLION HAVE BEEN USED, WHICH SHOULD HAVE LEFT THE WORLD DOWN TO ITS LAST 7 MILLION TONS. IN FACT, COPPER RESERVES ARE CURRENTLY PUT AT 300 MILLION TONS.

THE ECOLYPTIC TRICK IS TO TAKE THE REPORTED LEVEL OF CURRENT RESERVES, PREDICT THEY WILL GROW BY LIMITED AMOUNTS (THE CLUB OF ROME'S FAMOUS COMPUTER STUDY ALLOWED NO MORE THAN A FIVE-FOLD EXPANSION), OBSERVE THAT TOTAL OUTPUT GROWS AT A GEOMETIC RATE AND SIMPLE FIND THE POINT WHERE THE LINES CROSS. FOR THE ROME CLUB, DISASTER STRIKES IN A CENTURY.

THE GOOD DR. MALTHUS DID THE SAME THING 176 YEARS AGO WITH FOOD (SUPPLIES WILL INCREASE ARITHMETICALLY) AND POPULATION (IT WILL GROW GEOMETRICALLY) TO CONCLUDE THAT ONLY FAMINE, PESTILENCE OR WAR WOULD PRESERVE THE BALANCE. IN FACT, AS INCOMES ROSE UNDER THE IMPACT OF THE INDUSTRIAL REVOLUTION, POPULATIONS EVENTUALLY LEVELED OFF BECAUSE ADVANCED NATIONS WERE NO LONGER PEOPLED LARGELY BY IMPOVERISHED PEASANTS DEPENDING ON CHILDREN TO PRESERVE THEM IN OLD AGE. AND FOOD SUPPLIES, THANKS TO A TECHNOLOCY THAT PERMITTED BOTH MORE INTENSIVE CULTIVATION AND RECLAIMED FORMERLY WASTE LAND, GREW FAR MORE RAPIDLY THAN THE MALTHUSIAN EQUATIONS ALLOWED.

THE POINT IS MADE EVEN MORE DRAMATICALLY WITH MINERAL RESOURCES. THE REPORTED RESERVES OF ANY ELEMENT OR METAL IN ANY GIVEN TIME ARE NOT, AS BECKERMAN OBSERVES, THE TURE RESERVES. COMPANIES IN COPPER, OIL AND LEAD WILL LOOK ONLY FOR AMOUNTS WORTH FINDING, GIVEN THEIR ESTIMATES OF PRICE AND DEMAND OVER THE NEXT FEW DECADES. IT IS THEIR "PROVEN" FINDS THAT ARE SOLEMNLY TAKEN AS THE FORESEEABLE LIMITS.

NEITHER INDUSTRY NOR ITS SUPPORTING GOVERNMENT AGENCIES WANT TO HEAR ABOUT STUDIES LIKE THOSE CITED BY PROF. BECKERMAN. ONE BASED ON SOME SAMPLINGS OF THE EARTH'S CRUST CONCLUDES THAT WITHIN ONE MILE OF THE SURFACE THERE IS ABOUT ONE MILLION TIMES THE KNOWN RESERVES OF EVERY INDUSTRIAL ELEMENT. SINCE THE CLUB OF ROME CONCLUDES THAT PHYSCIAL BANKRUPTCY OF KNOWN RESERVES WILL STRIKE IN ABOUT A CENTURY, BECKERMAN REASONS THAT THE "DISASTER" POINT IS NEARER TO 100 MILLION YEARS AWAY.

THE CURRENT OIL CRISIS PROVIDES BECKERMAN WITH A SPLENDID WORKING EXAMPLE OF HIS THESIS. THE CRISIS, OF COURSE, IS ONE OF PRICE, NOT EXHAUSTION. PRODUCER COUNTRIES HAVE FORMED A CARTEL TO MATCH THAT OF THE REFINING AND DISTRIBUTING COMPANIES, AND THE TWO CARTELS HAVE QUADRUPLED THE PRICE.

THIS, AS ANY ECONOMIST WOULD HAVE PREDICTED, HAS STIMULATED THE SEARCH FOR NEW OIL SUPPLIES, NEW TECHNOLOGIES AND SUBSTITUTE SOURCES OF ENERGY. IT HAS REVIVED INTEREST IN OIL FROM SHALE AND TAR SANDS, PROMISES A BONANZA FOR THE MAKERS OF NUCLEAR REACTORS, TURNED ATTENTION TO COAL AND AROUSED RESEARCH IN ENERGY FROM THE SUN, THE FUSION OF HYDROGEN AND OTHER PREVIOUSLY EXOTIC SOURCES.

IT HAS ALSO LED TO SOME REVISED ESTIMATES OF OIL RESERVES. ALL DURING THE '60S, THE OIL COMPANIES, WITH WHAT THEY THOUGHT WAS A SECURE STAKE IN CHEAP ARAB OIL, ENCOURAGED THE BRITISH GOVERNMENT TO BELIEVE THAT THE NORTH SEA WAS A COSTLY ADVENTURE WITH LIMITED PROSPECTS. NOW, A LESS NAIVE GOVERNMENT, PROPELLED BY THE FACTS OF COSTLY IMPORTED OIL AND A HEALTHY SUSPICION OF THE COMPANIES' INTEREST, WILL SOON BE ABLE TO ANNOUNDE THAT BRITAIN CAN BECOME AN EXPORTER OF OIL IN THE NEXT DECADE. THERE IS MORE THAN ENOUGH ON BRITAIN'S COASTAL SHELF ALONE TO SUPPLY THE NATION'S DEMAND AT THE OLD PRICES, A FACT THAT HAD HITHERTO APPEARED ONLY IN UNOFFICIAL REPORTS.

THE ECODOOMSTERS, AS BECKERMAN OBSERVES, TAKES A LARGELY STATIC VIEW OF BOTH RESOURCES AND TECHNOLOGY. THEIR QUATIONS WOULD NOT HAVE FORESEEN THAT ALUMINUM WOULD CHANGE FROM A LUXURY METAL TO THROWAWAY USES BECAUSE OF THE DISCOVERY OF ABUNDANT BAUXITE.

INDEED, SOME OF THE SHREWDER MINING COMPANIES ARE ALREADY DISCUSSING THE THREATENED FALL IN THEIR PRICES WHEN NEW TECHNOLOGY ENABLES THEM TO EXTRACT HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS OF TONS OF METALS IN THE NODULES ON THE BED OF THE SEA.

IF A PAPAL COURT HAD SET UP A CLUB OF ROME 10 CENTURIES AGO, IT WOULD HAVE ISSUED ALARMING CRIES ABOUT A WORLD OF HOMELESS MEN. TIMBER WAS DISAPPEARING, STONE WAS HARD TO WORK EASILY AND REFORESTATION WAS NOT ON THE MEDIEVAL HORIZON. FOR THAT MATTER, NEITHER WERE CONCRETE OR PLASTIC.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 014 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107108

HEARINGS

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WHICH LEADS PROF. BECKERMAN TO DISCUSS POLLUTION, THE OTHER ALLEGED CONSTRAINT ON ECONOMIC GROWTH. HERE TOO, BECKERMAN NOTES, RECENT HISTORY HAS BEEN UNKIND TO THE DOOMSTERS. THANKS IN PART TO THE PRESSURE FROM ENVIRONMENTALISTS, ADVANCED NATIONS HAVE DISCOVERED THEY CAN CLEAN UP AIR AND WATER AT A RELATIVELY LIMITED COST.

THE CLUB OF ROME ASSUMED, UNDER ITS MOST "OPTIMISTIC" FORECAST, THAT THE RATIO OF POLLUTION TO OUTPUT WOULD FALL BY 25 PERCENT IN THE NEXT CENTURY. BUT IN 15 YEARS, LONDON HAS CUT ITS POLLUTION BY 85 PERCENT, DOUBLED THE HOURS OF WINTER SUNSHINE AND COUNTED 55 SPECIES OF FISH IN A THAMES THAT HAD NONE. OVER THIS PERIOD, MOREOVER, INCOMES AND OUTPUT HAVE RISEN STEADILY.

THE ONLY SERIOUS QUESTION IS HOW MUCH ANY SOCIETY WANTS TO SPEND ON DEPOLLUTING ITS ENVIRONMENT, A NICE EXERCISE IN COST-BENEFIT ANALYSIS. INDEED, IT MAY TURN OUT THAT CLEANER AIR AND WATER CAN INCREASE TOTAL OUTPUT -- EXPANDING PRODUCTIVITY WITH HEALTHIER WORKERS, REDUCING TRANSPORTATION COSTS BY ELIMINATING SMOG-CAUSED TRAFFIC JAMS AND THE LIKE.

THE DOOMSTERS MAY STILL ENTERTAIN SOME LEGITIMATE DOUBTS ABOUT BECKERMAN'S SWIFT DISMISSAL OF THE FOOD AND POPULATION PROBLEM, PARTICULARLY AMONG THE POOREST NATIONS. CHINA IS A GOOD CASE FOR HIS AGRUMENT BUT INDIA IS NOT, AT LEAST AT FIRST GLANCE.

AS DISEASE DISAPPEARED IN THE EARLY YEARS OF THE CHINESE REVOLUTION, POPULATION EXPANDED RAPIDLY. THEN, WITH AN ADEQUATE LEVEL OF LIFETIME EXISTENCE ASSURED, POPULATION BEGAN LEVELING OFF. BUT IN INDIA, WHERE THERE IS LITTLE GROWTH IN INCOME PER HEAD AND THE CENTRAL GOVERNMENT IS WEAK -- EXCEPT IN MILITARY ADVENTURES -- THE ELABORATE FAMILY PLANNING PROGRAMS HAVE HAD LITTLE IMPACT ON THE VILLAGES WHERE FOUR OF FIVE LIVE.

THIS HOWEVER, IS NO ARGUMENT FOR INDIA TO RESTRAIN GROWTH. QUITE THE OPPOSITE. BECKERMAN WOULD CONTEND THAT IT IS THE VERY FAILURE OF THE INDIAN ECONOMY TO PROVIDE AN ADEQUATE LIVING STANDARD WHICH ENCOURAGES THE BIRTHS THAT PRESS ON LIMITED SUPPLIES OF FOOD.

BECKERMAN CONCLUDES:

"THERE IS NO SUBSTANCE AT ALL IN THE MAIN FEARS OF THE ECODOOMSTERS. . .THE FEAR THAT RISING POLLUTION AND DECLINING SUPPLIES OF RAW MATERIALS WILL BRING ECONOMIC GROWTH TO AN END IN A SUDDEN, AND HENCE CATASTROPHIC MANNER, WITHIN A RELEVANT TIME PERIOD, UNLESS. . .MEASURES ARE TAKEN TO BRING ECONOMIC GROWTH TO A HALT NOW. . .THE ASSUMPTIONS UNDERLYING THESE FEARFUL PREDICTIONS BEAR NO RELATION TO ACTUAL TRENDS IN POLLUTION CONTROL OR POLICIES, TO THE CONTINUAL DEVELOPMENT OF RAW MATERIALS AND TECHNOLOGIES, TO THE INCREASES IN THE FOOD SUPPLIES AND TO THE REDUCTION IN BIRTHRATES. . .THAT HAVE TAKEN PLACE IN THE PAST, THAT ARE STILL TAKING PLACE, AND THAT CAN BE CLEARLY ANTICIPATED FOR THE FORESEEABLE FUTURE."

SENATOR RANDOLPH. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

I WANT TO TAKE THIS OPPORTUNITY TO ASK YOU TO RETURN TO YOUR PREPARED STATEMENT. YOU MENTION, "THE FACT IS THAT S. 3277, S. 3549, AND S. 3560 ALL PUT SUCH A STRONG EMPHASIS ON SOLID RESOURCE RECOVERY THROUGH GRANT, LOAN, AND TECHNICAL ASSISTANCE PROVISIONS ATTESTS TO THE ALMOST UNQUESTIONED NEED FOR THE COUNTRY TO EMBARK UPON A VERY SERIOUS RECYCLING COURSE."

I USE THIS POINT IN YOUR TESTIMONY TO SAY SOMETHING THAT I WANT THE RECORD TO REFLECT. THAT IS MY APPRECIATION AS CHAIRMAN OF THE PANEL TO SENATOR DOMENICI OF NEW MEXICO WHO IS THE AUTHOR OF THE MEASURE, SENATE BILL 3277. I USE IT TO ATTEST TO HIS DILIGENCE AS YOU HAVE ATTESTED HERE IN THE LANGUAGE THAT I JUST QUOTED. IN THE FOUR HEARINGS THAT WE HAVE HAD, THAT INCLUDES TODAY'S SESSION, HE HAS CHAIRED IN PART A FEW OF THOSE DAYS, AND HE HAS BEEN IN ALMOST CONSTANT ATTENDANCE LISTENING TO THE WITNESSES AND CARRYING ON THE COLLOQUY THAT HELPS TO BUILD FOR US A VERY EXCELLENT RECORD. I HOPE HE WILL NOT FEEL THAT THIS IS A PLEASANTRY WHEN I SPEAK OF HIS YEAR AND A HALF OF SERVICE ON THE PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE. IT IS GRATIFYING TO KNOW THAT A YOUNGER MEMBER OF THE SENATE COMES TO GRIPS WITH A PROBLEM SUCH AS WE HAVE HERE AND INITIATES LEGISLATION HIMSELF AS EMBODIED IN ONE OF THE MEASURES THAT WE ARE CONSIDERING.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 015 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107109

HEARINGS

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ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

OUT OF ALL OF THIS I KNOW THERE CAN COME A COOPERATIVE EFFORT IN DRAFTING A MEASURE WHICH WILL HOPEFULLY RECOMMEND ITSELF TO THE MEMBERS OF OUR COMMITTEE. AS ONE WITNESS HAS SAID TODAY, USING THE WORD "SENSIBLE," I WOULD WANT WHATEVER WE DO TO BE REALISTIC AND WORKABLE.

MR. SHEEHAN. I THINK YOU AND THE WITNESSES HERE CAN AGREE THAT WE MUST BE BOTH REALISTIC AND PRESENT SOMETHING THAT IF IT BECOMES LAW CAN BE WORKABLE, IS THAT CORRECT?

MR. SHEEHAN. IT IS.

SENATOR RANDOLPH. I ALSO TAKE THIS OPPORTUNITY TO NOTE IN GENERAL FIGURES, THAT OF THOSE PERSONS, SENATOR DOMENICI, WHO ARE REPRESENTING ORGANIZATIONS HERE TODAY THAT ARE VERY CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT WE WILL DO -- WHAT THE CONGRESS WILL POSSIBLY DO -- THAT YOU REPRESENT 1,700,000 WORKERS DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY, THAT IS THROUGH THE MEMBERSHIP OF THE UNIONS THAT ARE REPRESENTED BY THOSE WHO SIT AT THE WITNESS TABLE TODAY. SO WHEN WE MEET TOMORROW AND WE HAVE THE WITNESSES APPEARING FOR THE ENVIRONMENT PANEL -- MS. TAYLOR, JOHN MATTHEWS, AND LEE LANE, AND THEN ANOTHER PANEL INCLUDING MRS. CLUSEN OF THE LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS, ILENE GOLDMAN OF CONSUMER ACTION NOW AND JOHN BREIER, SENSIBLE CITIZENS AGAINST THROWAWAYS, AND ARTHUR PURCELL, CENTER FOR SCIENCE IN THE PUBLIC INTEREST. THESE PERSONS WILL BE WELCOMED BY THIS PANEL AS WE HAVE WELCOMED ALL THOSE WHOM WE HAVE ASKED TO TESTIFY OR WHO HAVE INDICATED THAT THEY HAD A RESPONSIBLE POINT OF VIEW TO PRESENT TO THE COMMITTEE. TODAY THE MEMBERS OF THE PANEL ARE GRATEFUL FOR YOUR TESTIMONY.

MR. SHEEHAN, YOU STRONGLY URGE THAT ANY SOLID WASTE LEGISLATION INCLUDE THE EMPLOYEE PROTECTION PROVISION -- SECTION 122 OF SENATE BILL 3549. YOU SPEAK OF THE DESIRABILITY OF PREVENTING THE HARRASSEMTN OF WORKERS WHO WEEK FULL ENFORCEMENT OF THE ACT AND TO PREVENT WHAT YOU CALL ENVIRONMENTAL BLACKMAIL THROUGH THE IRRESPONSIBLE USE OF PLANT SHUTDOWN THREATS. HAS THERE BEEN A PROBLEM FOR OTHER ENVIRONMENTAL CONTROL ACTIVITIES THAT CAUSE YOU TO ZERO IN ON THIS IMPOSITION?

MR. SHEEHAN. YES. MR. CHAIRMAN. BEFORE I COMMENT ON THAT, I WOULD JUST LIKE TO MAKE ONE OTHER REFERENCE. YOU MENTIONED THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF MEMBERSHIP OF WORKING PEOPLE THAT ARE SEATED AT THIS TABLE THIS MORNING AND I WOULD HOPE THAT WE ARE PRESENTING TO YOU A PROPOSAL WITH REGARD TO THIS WHOLE SOLID WASTE AND MINERAL POLICY IN THE UNITED STATES AND THAT WE WOULD NOT BE MISJUDGED TO BE CONCERNED SOLELY WITH SO-CALLED CAN ISSUE, ALTHOUGH IT IS, TO A LARGE SEGMENT OF OUR MEMBERS, A VERY CRITICAL AREA.

I DO THINK, AND I AM GLAD YOU MENTIONED THOSE FIGURES BECAUSE YOU ARE POINTING OUT THE ENORMITY OF THIS LEGISLATION EVEN BEYOND THAT PARTICULAR AREA AND WITH A UNION OF OUR SIZE THAT GOES INTO EVERYTHING IN THE EXTRACTIVE INDUSTRY, AND THE MANUFACTURING INDUSTRY, HAS TO BE CONCERNED ABOUT THIS PROBLEM, NOT ONLY DISPOSAL, BUT RECOVERY AND REUSE AND THE WHOLE QUESTION OF THE MINERAL POLICY. THIS IS WHAT THIS LEGISLATION MR. CHAIRMAN, IS ALL ABOUT AND IS BORDERING ON WITH REGARD TO OTHER LEGISLATION PENDING BEFORE THE CONGRESS.

REGARDING AREAS OF ENVIRONMENTAL CONCERN, TONY MAZZOCCHI EARLIER THIS MORNING MADE REFERENCE TO THIS. WE ARE SUBJECTED TO, UNFORTUNATELY, A VERY HEAVY BARRAGE OF ENVIRONMENTAL BLACKMAIL. I THINK IT IS VERY UNFAIR THAT WORKERS WHO HAVE -- THE ONLY THING THAT THEY HAVE IS THAT JOB -- HAVE INDUSTRIES TRY TO SOLICIT THEIR OPPOSITION TO NEEDED ENVIRONMENTAL ABATEMENT, EITHER IN THE CASE OF AMBIENT POLLUTION IN THE COMMUNITY OR IN CASES OF OCCUPATIONAL POLLUTION INSIDE THE PLANT, BY BEING TOLD THAT IF WE INSIST UPON OR SUPPORT ABATEMENT ACTIVITIES THAT THIS WILL RESULT IN JOB LOSSES.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 016 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107110

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REGARDING OSHA, WHICH IS CURRENTLY UNDER ATTACK IN THE CONGRESS AS YOU KNOW, THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES JUST VOTED THE OTHER DAY TO DELETE 85 PERCENT OF THE WORK PLACES IN AMERICAN FROM THIS ACT ON THE CHARGES THAT JOBS ARE AT STAKE.

I THINK IT IS A TRAGEDY THAT THIS KIND OF ACTIVITY IS TAKING PLACE DESPITE THE FACT THAT THERE IS NOT ONE INSTANCE WHERE UNDER THE OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY ACT ANY PLANT HAS SHUT DOWN, AND THE FACT THAT WE ARE BEGINNING TO REALIZE MR. CHAIRMAN, THAT WE ARE LIVING WITH OUR ENVIRONMENTAL CONTROL SITUATION -- THAT THERE ARE ABATEMENT SCHEDULES THAT ARE PRACTICAL AND FEASIBLE, AND THAT ARE BEING PUT INTO OPERATION AND THAT IN MANY INSTANCES IN THE PAST WHERE THE INDUSTRY HAS SAID IT CANNOT COMPLY, THEY ARE COMPLYING, INDUSTRIES ARE COMPETING TO SELL ABATEMENT EQUIPMENT.

IT IS FOR THAT REASON THAT WE HAVE BEEN URGUING, FOR SOME TIME, THIS CONCEPT OF ENVIRONMENTAL BLACKMAIL. IT IS NOW IN THE WATER POLLUTION CONTROL ACTS INCIDENTALLY, AND IT DOES STIPULATE THAT IF MANAGEMENT ALLEGES THAT THERE IS A JOB LOSS BECAUSE OF THE PENDING ABATEMENT ACTION, THAT THE WORKER, UNION OR ANYBODY IN THE PLANT COULD ASK FOR AN EPA PUBLIC HEARING AND THAT EPA, AS I UNDERSTAND, ON ONE OF THE FEW OCCASIONS WOULD BE EQUIPPED WITH SUBPENA POWERS TO EVALUATE THE INDUSTRY'S CHARGE, WHICH I UNDERSTAND IS RATHER UNIQUE. IF JOBS ARE GOING TO BE LOST AND THE INDUSTRY CAN PROVE IT, THAT IS SOMETHING EVERYBODY WANTS TO KNOW, BUT THE IRRATIONAL AND TRAGIC RESORT TO JOB LOSS CLAIMS WHEN THE NATION IS TRYING TO GET ABOUT THE BUSINESS OF CLEANING UP THE ENVIRONMENT, LEAVES THE WORKER IN AN INDEFENSIBLE POSITION.

IT IS VERY HARD FOR US TO DEFEND OURSELVES. WE ARE SUGGESTING NOT ONLY IN THIS LEGISLATION, BUT AIR POLLUTION CONTROL LEGISLATION, THAT THERE BE INSERTED TH IS PROTECTION OF PUBLIC HEARINGS BY A PUBLIC AGENCY WITH SUBPENA POWERS.

SENATOR RANDOLPH. I THINK BECAUSE OF THE RESPONSE THAT YOU HAVE GIVEN, MR. SHEEHAN, THAT IT IS NOT IMPROPER FOR ME TO SAY THAT IN 1938 WHEN I WAS A MEMBER OF THE LABOR COMMITTEE OF THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE FIRST FAIR LABOR STANDARDS ACT BEING ENACTED INTO LAW. AT THAT TIME WE HAD OPPOSITION FROM SEGMENTS WITHIN INDUSTRY AND BUSINESS. LATER I TALKED WITH THOSE PERSONS WHO SAID FRANKLY THEY REGRETTED THAT THEY HAD GIVEN TESTIMONY AGAINST THE PURPOSE OF THAT LEGISLATION. THAT IS A LONG TIME AGO, 1938.

WE WERE ATTEMPTING THEN TO DO NOTHING MORE OR LESS THAN WHAT WE BELIEVE TO BE A BOLD APPROACH TO WORKER NEEDS, WHICH ARE MANAGEMENT NEEDS ALSO. THEY CERTAINLY DO NOT STAND IN ANY POLARIZED POSITIONS IN OUR THINKING. THEY WERE TRYING TO ESTABLISH A 25-CENT AN HOUR MINIMUM WAGE; THAT WAS ON JOBS THAT WERE CONSIDERED IN INTERSTATE COMMERCE.

I ONLY MENTION THIS AS A BACKGROUND BECAUSE DURING MY TENURE HERE IN THE HOUSE AND IN THE SENATE, I HAVE BEEN WORKING ON MATTERS OF THIS KIND CONSTANTLY. THERE ARE SOME MEMBERS OF CONGRESS WHO GIVE THEIR PRIORITIES TO CERTAIN LEGISLATION THAT ARE NOT THESE THAT I MENTIONED, BUT IN MY MEMBERSHIP ON THIS COMMITTEE AND IN THE COMMITTEE ON LABOR AND PUBLIC WELFARE, WE HAVE HAD TO COME TO GRIPS WITH OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY LEGISLATION, WITH LEGISLATION THAT WOULD INSURE, AS FAR AS POSSIBLE, SAFETY AND HEALTH OF THE COAL MINERS OF THIS COUNTRY.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 017 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107111

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ARTICLE CLIPPING

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HERE WE HAVE CONSIDERED, SENATOR DOMENICI, QUESTIONS OF ENVIRONMENT, THE QUALITY OF LIFE, THE CLEANING OF THE WATER AND CLEANING OF THE AIR AND, NOW, HOPEFULLY, SOME SENSIBLE, SOME REALISTIC, SOME WORKABLE PROGRAM TO COPE WITH THE SOLID WASTE PROBLEM.

IT IS IN THAT CONTEXT, MR. SHEEHAN, THAT I COMMEND YOUR STATEMENT. IT IS VERY CAREFULLY BROUGH TOGETHER IN A WAY THAT IT WOULD BE A CONTRIBUTION TO THIS PANEL AS ARE THE OTHER STATEMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN PRESENTED THIS MORNING AND THOSE WHICH HAVE BEEN GIVEN ON THE 3 PREVIOUS DAYS.

I AM GOING TO HAVE TO LEAVE BECAUSE OF A COMMITMENT I HAVE.

SENATOR DOMENICI. I WILL ASK THIS QUESTION BECAUSE OF THE APPROACH MR. SHEEHAN HAS GIVEN, OR EVEN IF HE HADN'T GIVEN THAT COMMENT, I WOULD ASK THE SAME QUESTION OF ALL OF THESE WITNESSES.

WE HAVE ANNOUNCED THE WITNESSES FOR TOMORROW, AND IF YOU WILL, SENATOR DOMENICI, CLOSE OUT TODAY'S HEARING, IF YOUR TIME SCHEDULE PERMITS, I WOULD APPRECIATE IT.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH, GENTLEMEN. THE QUESTION THAT I POSE TO EACH OF YOU IS A QUESTION THAT WAS SOUGHT FROM MR. SHEEHAN IN REFERENCE TO THIS SO-CALLED THREAT PROBLEM WHICH MAY EXIST IN VARYING DEGREES IN THE OTHER UNIONS.

MR. MOORE, YOU MAY BE THE SECOND AS WE RUN DOWN THE TABLE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

SEANTOR DOMENICI (PRESIDING). DO YOU CARE TO RESPOND TO THE CHAIRMAN'S QUESTION?

MR. MOORE. I DON'T KNOW OF ANY OCCASION IN OUR INDUSTRY THAT WE HAVE HAD THIS PROBLEM. IN FACT, TO BE TRUTHFUL WITH YOU, OUR UNION WAS WORKING IN THE AREA OF ENVIRONMENT FOR SOME 8 YEARS. OUR UNION WAS INSTRUMENTAL IN GETTING THE INDUSTRY INVOLVED IN THE PROBLEMS OF LITTER AND SOLID WASTE. NOW, I DON'T KNOW OF ANY INCIDENT WITHIN OUR ORGANIZATION, WITHIN OUR INDUSTRY, WHERE WE HAVE HAD A BLACKMAIL PROBLEM AT ALL.

SENATOR DOMENICI. MR. CHESTER?

MR. CHESTER. I HAVE HEARD AND READ CASES, SENATOR DOMENICI, OF ENVIRONMENTAL BLACKMAIL AND DISCUSSED IT WITH A MEMBER OF EPA WHO WAS LABOR LIAISON TO MR. TRAIN, MR. SEARS.

THERE ARE, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, CITED CASES AND SPECIFIC CASES OF ENVIRONMENTAL BLACKMAIL AGAINST THE EMPLOYEE. FOR ME TO BE MORE SPECIFIC THAN THAT I WOULD HAVE TO REFER AND TRY TO GET SOMETHING FROM A RECORD.

(A RESPONSE FROM MR. CHESTER TO THE ABOVE QUESTION MAY BE FOUND AT P. 675.)

SENATOR DOMENICI. MR. LABAFF?

MR. LABAFF. TO MY KNOWLEDGE, WE HAVE HAD NO EXPERIENCE WITH THIS IN OUR INDUSTRY.

SENATOR DOMENICI. MR. MAZZOCCHI?

MR. MAZZOCCHI. WE ARE VERY SUPPORTIVE OF THE COMMENTS THAT JACK SHEEHAN OF THE STEEL WORKERS MADE. HIS COMMENTS CHARACTERIZE THE SITUATION IN OUR INDUSTRY. WE LIVE UNDER ENVIRONMENTAL BLACKMAIL EVERY DAY OF THE YEAR. RIGHT NOW WE ARE DEEPLY INVOLVED IN THE THREAT OF TWO MILLION JOBS NATIONALLY OVER THE CREATION OF A LIVABLE STANDARD ON VINYL CHLORIDE, SO WE ARE CONSTANTLY CONFRONTED WITH A QUESTION OF YOUR JOB OR YOUR LIFE. YOU ARE ALL AWARE OF THE FAMOUS UNION CARBIDE CASE WHERE THEY THREATENED TO SHUT DOWN THE PLANT.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 018 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107112

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

THEY CLAIMED THEY COULD NOT MEET THE ABATEMENT DATES. IT TURNED OUT THEY MET THE ABATEMENT DATES, PEOPLE DIDN'T LOSE THEIR JOBS; IN FACT THEY HAD TO HIRE CONSIDERABLY MORE PEOPLE TO HELP WITH THE ABATEMENT PROCEDURES. JACK DESCRIBED IT VERY WELL. OUR PEOPLE WHOULD NOT BE PUT IN THIS POSTURE OF SAYING: WELL, WE KNOW WHAT WE ARE GOING TO BE DOING, WE WILL HARM OUR ENVIRONMENT AND OURSELVES, OR WE WILL BE WITHOUT A JOB.

WE DID A STUDY OF SOME 95 PLANT CLOSINGS, AND WE COULD ONLY VAGUELY ATTRIBUTE TWO OF THOSE, IF YOU STRETCHED IT, TO SOME SORT OF ENVIRONMENTAL REASON. THERE IS NO ASSOCIATION BETWEEN PLANT SHUTDOWN AND ENVIRONMENTAL DURESS, SO TO SPEAK; IT IS USUALLY FROM SOME OTHER CAUSE, AND THEN IT IS ATTRIBUTED TO EITHER A WORKER'S INSISTENCE ON CLEANING UP THE PLANT ENVIRONMENT OR THE COMMUNITY CLEANING IT UP; THEY USE IT AS AN EXCUSE TO TAKE THEIR LICKS AT BOTH GROUPS. IT IS A REAL PROBLEM WITH US. WE CONFRONT IT EVERY DAY.

THAT WORKER PROTECTION PROVISION CERTAINLY IS IMPERATIVE TO INCLUDE IN ANY LEGISLATION, OTHERWISE DURESS DOES TAKE ITS TOLL IN MAKING WORKERS FEARFUL OF SAYING ANYTHING FOR FEAR THAT THEIR EMPLOYER WILL THINK THEY ARE MAKING A COLLECTIVE EXPRESSION SO THEY ARE FEARFUL OF A CLOSEDOWN OR A PLANT MOVE.

SENATOR DOMENICI. MR. SHEEHAN, DO I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE GETTING AT HERE CERTAINLY IS NOT DIRECTED AT YOUR LEADERSHIP, ON BEHALF OF YOUR MEMBERSHIP NOT WANTING TO TAKE THE POSITION WILL REFERENCE TO UNREASONABLE IMPOSITIONS EITHER UPON YOU OR THE INDUSTRY THAT YOU WORK FOR, RATHER THAT YOU WANT SOME MECHANISM TO INSURE OBJECTIVITY IN TERMS OF THE FACTFINDING UPON WHICH YOU WOULD BE ASKED TO BASE A CONCLUSION ON BEHALF OF YOUR MEMBERS, IS THAT GENERALLY IT?

YOU DON'T WANT TO BE LED DOWN THE PRIMROSE PATH OF DEFENDING YOUR JOB, WHEN THE FACTS ARE REALLY NOT THERE WITH RESPECT TO THE IMPACT OF ENVIRONMENTAL ABUSE ON YOUR EMPLOYEES.

MR. SHEEHAN. YES, I GOT HUNG UP ON YOUR TERM "UNREASONABLE" BECAUSE IT IS OUR CONTENTION LARGELY THAT, AS TONY MAZZOCCHI MENTIONED IN HIS EXAMPLES OF DETERMINING WHAT THE ACTUAL FACTS ARE, THE UNREASONABLENESS HAS BEEN THE CHARGES OF JOB LOSSES, WHILE THE REASONABLENESS HAS BEEN THE FEASIBILITY OF THE STANDARDS THAT INDUSTRY WAS BEING ASKED TO COMPLY WITH.

IN MANY OF THE INDUSTRIES, IN THE STEEL INDUSTRY AND IN THE SMELTING INDUSTRY WHICH YOU ARE WELL AWARE OF, THIS ISSUE IS VERY HOTLY CONTESTED. WE ARE BEING TOLD THAT THERE CAN BE NO ENVIRONMENTAL CONTROLS AND NO GOVERNMENT INTERFERENCE, AND THEN YOU MOVE INTO THE IDEA OF SCARCITY OF MATERIALS AND MINERALS POLICY AND WE ARE TOLD THAT WE CANNOT AFFORD TO PRODUCE UNDER A CONTROLLED ENVIRONMENTAL SETUP. YOU ARE RIGHT, WE ARE OPPOSED TO THE UNREASONABLE CLAIMS BECAUSE WE ARE CONVINCED THAT THE LEGISLATION, FOR THE MOST PART, IS REASONABLE.

SENATOR DOMENICI. ON THE OTHER HAND, NONE OF YOU SEE ANY OBJECTION TO REPRESENTING YOUR WORK FORCE, YOUR MEMBERSHIP IN TERMS OF UNREASONABLE IMPOSITIONS UPON THE INDUSTRY THAT YOU WORK FOR. YOU ARE HERE TODAY SPEAKING OF SOME OF THE LEGISLATION PENDING HERE AND ELSEWHERE AS IN YOUR OPINION BEING UNREASONABLE IN TERMS OF TRULY PUTTING YOUR EMPLOYEES IN A JOBLESS POSTURE, AND YOU'RE QUESTIONING THE TOTAL NEED AND THE ENVIRONMENTAL AUTHENTICITY OF SOME OF IT, IS THAT CORRECT?

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 019 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107113

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ARTICLE CLIPPING

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MR. SHEEHAN. IN MY OWN PERSPECTIVE, EPA IS OPERATING UNDER LEGISLATIVE AUTHORITIES THAT THE CONGRESS HAS ALREADY GRANTED IT. IT PROMULGATES STANDARDS WITH RELATION TO THOSE AUTHORITIES AND THESE ARE SUBJECTED TO PUBLICATION IN THE FEDERAL REGISTER AND TO THE ADMINISTRATIVE PROCEDURE ACT. WE FEEL THAT WE DO HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY WHERE THESE PRECISE IMPLEMENTATIONS OF THOSE AUTHORITIES ARE INJURIOUS, TO MAKE OBJECTIONS TO THEM. HERE, HOWEVER, WE ARE TALKING ABOUT BAN-THE-CAN LEGISLATION. HERE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT A SPECIFIC TYPE OF SOURCE REDUCTION AND AT LEAST THE CONTENTION OF THE STEELWORKERS HERE IS THAT WE DON'T THINK WE ARE AT THE STAGE TO GET INVOLVED WITH SOURCE REDUCTION BECAUSE IN MY OWN MIND, WE FEEL THAT SOURCE REDUCTION IS SOMETHING THAT HAS TO BE RELATED MORE TO A CRITICAL SHORTAGE OF ENERGY OR CRITICAL SHORTAGE OF THE MATERIAL, AND NOT JUST TO THE LITTER PROBLEM. IT IS IN THAT AREA WHICH WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT ESTABLISHING A LEGISLATIVE AUTHORITY FOR THE AGENCY.

SENATOR DOMENICI. MR. SHEEHAN, I WOULD ASSUME THAT YOU WOULD AGREE THAT WE HAVE QUITE A BACKGROUND OF INCONSISTENT INFORMATION ABOUT THE STATUS OF AMERICA'S MINERAL WELL-BEING AND THAT YOU WOULD AGREE THAT THESE UNITED STATES OUGHT TO SET ABOUT IN AN OBJECTIVE MANNER TO EVALUATE THIS. YOU HAVE INDICATED THAT WE ARE NOT DOING A VERY GOOD JOB IN THAT REGARD. YOU ARE SAYING WE OUGHT TO KNOW WITH OBJECTIVITY THE EXTENT OF THESE VARIOUS VIRGIN SOURCES BOTH WITHIN OUR COUNTRY AND OUTSIDE, BEFORE WE ADOPT ANY POLICY THAT INFRINGES UPON THEIR USE AS A PRINCIPAL SOURCE OF CONTROLLING SOLID WASTE. IS THAT WHAT YOU WERE SAYING?

MR. SHEEHAN. I WOULD THINK SO. I WOULD THINK DESPITE THE FACT THAT THE LEGISLATION BEFORE US IS A STIMULUS TO RESOURCE RECOVERY, IT ADMITS THAT THERE ARE MARKET PROBLEMS. I DON'T THINK YOU ARE GOING TO OVERCOME THE MARKET PROBLEMS UNLESS THERE IS A REAL COMMITMENT TO THE FEELING THAT WE NEED TO GET AT THE WASTE BECAUSE WE HAVE TO RECOVER IT, AND THAT ALL COMES BACK TO OUR MINERAL POLICY WHICH H AS NOT BEEN UPDATED SINCE THE PALEY REPORT BACK IN ABOUT 1930. THE BOYD COMMISSION ON MATERIALS POLICY HAS MOVED IN THAT DIRECTION. YOU HAVE TO START IN THIS AREA.

SENATOR DOMENICI. JUST A FEW MORE QUESTIONS. I KNOW WE HAVE BEEN HERE A LONG TIME.

THE SECOND REPORT TO CONGRESS ON RESOURCE RECOVERY AND SOURCE REDUCTION WAS REFERRED TO BY YOU IN YOUR COMMENTS. ON PAGE 62 WE FIND THE CONCLUSIONS AND RECOMMENDATION. YOU BORROWED SIGNIFICANTLY FROM THAT WITH REFERENCE TO THE CAVEATS ABOUT CONTROLS TO CONSERVE RESOURCES. I WOULD ASK YOU TO JUST SCAN THE BALANCE OF THAT PAGE OVER IN THE LEFT COLUMN WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT PRODUCT CONTROLS FOR RESOURCE RECOVERY AND I WILL JUST READ FOR YOU THE INTRODUCTORY PARAGRAPH:

PRODUCT CONTROL APPROACHES FOR RESOURCE RECOVERY COULD INCREASE THE RECYCLABILITY OF PRODUCTS BY MAKING IT EASIER, LESS COSTLY, TO SEPARATE AND RECOVER HIGH QUALITY SECONDARY MATERIALS AND COULD ESTABLISH PRODUCT SPECIFICATION REQUIRING THE USE OF SECONDARY MATERIAL INPUTS. AS IN THE CASE OF SOURCE REDUCTION, PRODUCT CONTROLS, TWO ISSUES ARE RAISED, SELECTION OF PRODUCTS TO BE CONTROLLED AND THE TYPES OF MECHANISMS THAT MIGHT BE UTILIZED.

SINCE YOU DIDN'T COMMENT ON ANY OF THAT SECTION, I TAKE IT YOU DISAGREE, OR DO YOU SEE SOME MERIT IN THAT CONTENTION BY THE ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY?

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 020 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107114

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MR. SHEEHAN. NO, I WOULDN'T SAY WE DISAGREE. THE THRUST OF THE POSITION WE ARE TAKING HERE TODAY IS THAT WE ARE NOT YET IN POSSESSION OF A FULLY ARTICULATED UNDERSTANDING OF THIS PROBLEM OF PRODUCT CONTROL, BUT THAT YOU MUST MOVE FORWARD, GOVERNMENTALLY, IN GETTING A GREATER UNDERSTANDING OF IT. TWO OR THREE CASES COME TO MIND. YOU TAKE THE IDEA THAT WE ARE PUTTING A GREAT DEAL OF EMPHASIS ON THE RECYCLABILITY OF CANS, BUT IF YOU GET INTO A BIMETAL CAN, DOES THIS NOT GO AGAINST OUR INTENT AND PURPOSE IN TALKING ABOUT RECYCLING? I AM INCLINED TO THINK IT WOULD. YET IN THE AREA OF AUTOMOBILE PRODUCTION AND AGAIN RECYCLING OF THESE FOR THE STEEL MILLS -- IT IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE COMBINATION OF METALS IN AN AUTOMOBILE MAKES THAT KIND OF A SCRAP NOT AS DESIRABLE AS IT SHOULD BE.

NOW SHOULD WE BE MOVING IN AND IN SOME WAY OR OTHER FERRETING OUT WHAT ARE PRODUCT SPECIFICATIONS WHICH I MENTIONED IN MY STATEMENT? WE ARE NOT OPPOSED TO THAT.

SENATOR DOMENICI. ARE WE NOT SAYING INDEED OF THE THRUST BEING MADE FOR RECYCLING AND REUSE, THERE COULD BE A SIGNIFICANT IMPACT ON WHETHER THIS WORKS OR NOT IN TERMS OF JUST SOME SMALL PERCENTAGE OF THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING ACCUMULATED BECAUSE IT MAKES THE WHOLE PROCESS UNECONOMICAL, IMPOSSIBLE, FAR MORE DIFFICULT AND THE LIKE AND YOU ARE NOT DISAGREEING, ARE YOU, THAT SOMEONE OUGHT TO BE CALLING THAT TO THE ATTENTION OF THE INDUSTRY OF AMERICA AND THE AMERICAN PEOPLE?

MR. SHEEHAN. NO, AND I PARTICULARLY APPRECIATE THIS REPORT WHICH IS A REPORT ON RESOURCE RECOVERY AND SOURCE REDUCTION.

SENATOR DOMENICI. WOULD YOU AGREE THAT MINIMAL STANDARDS IF WE HAVE STATE PLANS ALL OVER THE COUNTRY COULD END UP INCLUDING SOME PROHIBITIONS BECAUSE OF THE INTOLERABLE IMPACT ON RECYCLING, FEED IN THIS APPROACH ONCE WE HAVE A REPLY FROM THE STATES AS TO WHAT THEY CAN DO?

MR. SHEEHAN. THE EVIDENCE WE HAVE NOW ON SOURCE REDUCTION AS IT IS APPLIED IN THE STATES IS THAT IT IS BEING APPLIED WITHOUT A FULL UNDERSTANDING OF THE FULL SCOPE AND IMPACT OF SOURCE REDUCTION. IT IS BEING APPLIED PRIMARILY TO THE CAN AND PRIMARILY BECAUSE OF THE LITTER PROBLEM. I DON'T REALLY FEEL THAT THE GROUPS THAT ARE ADVOCATING IT HAVE REALLY A CONCERN WIDER THAN VISUAL POLLUTION, AND ALTHOUGH I DON'T WANT TO BE CRITICAL OF THEM IN THEIR CONCERN ABOUT VISIBLE POLLUTION, I CERTAINLY DON'T THINK THAT THEIR CONCEPT OF SOURCE REDUCTION IS ONE THAT HAS ALL THE ELEMENTS IN IT THAT A NATIONAL, FEDERAL POLICY CAN HAVE ON THIS MATTER, I DO MYSELF FEEL THAT IN A LOT OF THESE REGULATORY FUNCTIONS THAT THE PRIMARY REPOSITORY OF THOSE REGULATIONS SHOULD BE IN THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AND NOT IN THE STATES.

SENATOR DOMENICI. SO YOU DO AGREE THAT ANY PROGRAM FOR THE ORGANIZED HANDLING OF SOLID WASTE BY THESE UNITED STATES COULD ENTAIL SOME OF THE PROVISIONS WITH REFERENCE TO THAT SECTION WE ARE TALKING ABOUT, AN ATTEMPT TO EVALUATE NOT ONLY FROM THE STANDPOINT OF SOURCE REDUCTION, BUT FROM THE STANDPOINT OF A VIABLE SOLID WASTE DISPOSAL AND REUSE PROGRAM?

MR. SHEEHAN. IT CAN'T BE DONE AT THE SAME TIME. FIRST, THERE IS TOO MUCH EMOTIONALISM ON THE LITTER ISSUE, THEREFORE IT HAS TO BE A FEDERAL APPROACH AND, NO. 2, I THINK THE QUESTION OF A SOURCE REDUCTION HAS TO BE A CONTINUING, ONGOING, CONTINUING CONCERN BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. I WOULD NOT DISCARD IT, BUT I WOULD BE VERY APPREHENSIVE AT THIS POINT.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 021 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107115

HEARINGS

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AS A MATTER OF FACT, WE TESTIFIED TO THE NEED FOR BEGINNING DISCUSSION ON THE CONCEPT OF GIVING EPA AUTHORITY TO ISSUE SOURCE REDUCTION REGULATIONS, I DON'T THINK WE ARE READY FOR IT YET.

SENATOR DOMENICI. LET ME REFER TO ONE SECTION OF YOUR TESTIMONY. IF I CAN'T FIND IT, I WILL JUST AD LIB IT WITH YOU HERE.

YOU WERE SPEAKING OF THE GUARANTEES SECTION FOR BUY-BACK AND YOU WENT ON TO SAY:

IF WE CAN SUBSIDIZE FEDERAL PROCUREMENT OF RECYCLED MATERIAL, IT WOULD SEEM THAT WE MIGHT ALSO BE ABLE TO FIND A WAY TO SUBSIDIZE SIMILAR PROCUREMENT IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR.

DO YOU RECALL THAT?

MR. SHEEHAN. YES.

SENATOR DOMENICI. WHY DO WE NEED THAT IF WE HAD A NATIONAL POLICY OF BUY-BACK AND SOME REASONABLE MEANS OF INSURING THAT THOSE RESPONSIBLE WOULD BE CHARGED WITH PAYING FOR THE BUY-BACK IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR?

MR. SHEEHAN. WE WERE INTERPRETING THAT SECTION TO MEAN THAT THE INDUSTRY WOULD BE UNDER THE OBLIGATION TO BUY BACK, WOULD BUY BACK AT THE PREVAILING MARKET VALUE. HOWEVER, THAT DOES NOT TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION TRANSPORTATION COSTS. HENCE, YOU MAY HAVE A RECYCLABLE SYSTEM, WITH SOME COMPULSION TO BUY THE PRODUCT OF IT, AND YET THE TRANSPORTATION COSTS OF THE PRODUCTS DELIVERED TO STEEL MILL WOULD MAKE IT HIGHER THAN THE PREVAILING MARKET RATE, AND SO YOU MIGHT FIND THAT YOUR PRODUCT MAY NOT BE PURCHASED.

FOR INSTANCE, IF YOU TAKE THE STEEL MILL UP IN UTAH, WHAT WOULD BE THE PRICE OF RECYCLING MATERIAL OVER IN COLORADO AND IN PARTS OF NEW MEXICO, GETTING IT READY, AND THEN SENDING IT UP TO THE UTAH PLANT? THE TRANSPORTATION COSTS MAY OFFSET THE CONDITIONS THAT ARE IN THE ACT; NAMELY, THAT THE MILL THERE WOULD HAVE TO BUY AT THE PREVAILING MARKET VALUE. THERE MAY BE OTHER MATERIALS THERE THAT THEY BUY BECAUSE THEY WOULD BE CHEAPER. HENCE, WE DID STATE THAT IF YOU WOULD SAY TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IN ITS PROCUREMENT POLICY THAT IT MUST ABSORB SOME OF THE COST OF THAT RECYCLABLE MATERIAL COMING INTO THEM, IT MAY BE AT A HIGHER PRICE, 125 PERCENT HIGHER THAN THE MARKET VALUE, WE ARE SAYING OR SUGGESTING THAT IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR, YOU MIGHT WANT TO SEEK SOME METHOD OF MODERATING OR OFFSETTING THE COSTS.

IT MIGHT MEAN, FOR INSTANCE, AS WE STATE HERE, SUBSIDIZING THE TRANSPORTATION COST OF RECYCLABLE MATERIAL. THIS MAY BE GETTING INTO A SITUATION WHERE YOU OUGHT TO CONTROL THE PRICE WHERE THERE IS A DISCRIMINATION TAKING PLACE.

SENATOR DOMENICI. WOULDN'T IT BE FAIRER IF IT COULD BE FIGURED IN, TOO, IF THEY WERE COMPELLED TO BUY IT BACK AT A REASONABLE PRICE AND IT WAS FIGURED INTO THE OVERALL PRICE OF THE COMBINATION VIRGIN MATERIAL PRODUCED AND THE SCRAP?

WOULDN'T THAT BE FAIR? IF THE INDUSTRY HAD TO ABSORB IT, BUT IT WOULD COME OUT IN A SPLIT INCREASE IN COMBINED VIRGIN MATERIAL PLUS REUSED?

MR. SHEEHAN. I HAVE BEEN READING A GOOD DEAL ABOUT THIS WHOLE QUESTION OF OFFSETTING INCENTIVES AND SUBSIDY, AND ONE AUTHOR INDICATED THAT THERE OUGHT TO BE SOME KIND OF A TAX ON MATERIAL WHEN IT ENTERS THE PRODUCTION SCHEME, LIKE AN IMPORT OR TARIFF TAX.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 022 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107116

HEARINGS

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ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

/1/ APPENDIX B PRESENTS A CONCEPTUAL DISCUSSION OF THE SIGNIFICANCE, TECHNICAL FEASIBILITY, AND POTENTIAL IMPACT OF A WIDE VARIETY OF PRODUCT DESIGN MODIFICATIONS FOR SOURCE REDUCTION, RESOURCE RECOVERY, AND WASTE DISPOSAL PURPOSES.

/2/ MANDATORY DEPOSIT LAWS ARE IN EFFECT IN BOTH OREGON AND VERMONT, SEE CHAPTER 5 FOR FURTHER DISCUSSION.

WHAT WE ARE SUGGESTING HERE WAS MERELY THE FACT THAT THE PROCUREMENT POLICY OF THE U.S. GOVERNMENT IS SUCH A SMALL PART OF THE OVERALL DEMAND IN THE ECONOMY. IF YOU REALLY INTENDED TO CREATE A MARKET FOR RECYCLABLE MATERIAL, THE PURCHASING POWER OF THE U.S. GOVERNMENT IN TERMS OF ITS MILITARY PROCUREMENTS IS A VERY SMALL PART OF THAT OVERALL DEMAND ECONOMY, AND IF YOU DID THINK THAT THE SUBSIDY PROVISIONS WERE PREFERABLE OR WERE DESIRABLE IN THE PUBLIC SECTOR MARKET, THEN MAYBE YOU OUGHT TO MOVE THEM INTO THE PRIVATE SECTOR AS WELL.

WHAT YOU ARE SUGGESTING, IT SEEMS TO ME, WOULD FOLLOW THESE LINES, ALTHOUGH WE WEREN'T TRYING TO BE SPECIFIC. I WOULD THINK THE INDUSTRY, THE STEEL MILL THAT WOULD PURCHASE SUCH A PRODUCT AT A HIGHER PRICE WOULD ALSO BE ASKING FOR SOME TAX SUBSIDIES TO OFFSET THE HIGHER PRICE BECAUSE THEY PROBABLY WOULDN'T PASS IT DIRECTLY ON TO THE CONSUMER IN THAT FASHION.

WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THIS.

SENATOR DOMENICI. THINK OF THIS ON PAPER THOUGH, NONE OF YOU TALKED TO IT. THE GOVERNMENT HAS A POLICY OF BUYING RECYCLED PAPER. WHY COULDN'T WE REQUIRE IN TERMS OF THE STATE PLAN THAT EACH STATE HAVE SOME PREFERENCE IN THAT AREA AS PART OF THE SOLID WASTE DISPOSAL GAME PLAN; THEY WOULD ALSO BE INVOLVED IN BUYING THAT PRODUCT AS PART OF THE AIDING AND CREATING OF A MARKET. YOU DON'T SEE ANY BASIC OBJECTION WITHOUT KNOWING THE ECONOMICS?

MR. SHEEHAN. I THINK IT IS CONSISTENT WITH COMMITTING THIS NATION ON A RECYCLABLE TYPE OF ECONOMY.

SENATOR DOMENICI. LET ME READ A LITTLE BACKGROUND FROM EPA'S SECOND REPORT TO CONGRESS ON PACKAGING MATERIAL CONSUMPTION.

THE TERM "PRODUCT CONTROL" MAY BE DEFINED BROADLY TO INCLUDE ANY PUBLIC POLICY MEASURE DIRECTED AT REGULATING EITHER THE VOLUME OF SALES (QUANTITY) OR THE PHYSICAL DESIGN CHARACTERISTICS /1/ (QUALITY) OF SPECIFIC PRODUCTS OR GROUPS OF PRODUCTS SUPPLIED FOR DOMESTIC CONSUMPTION. (AS USED HERE, THE TERM "PRODUCT" CAN APPLY EITHER TO A FINAL ITEM OF MANUFACTURE, SUCH AS AN AUTOMOBILE OR A BEVERAGE CONTAINER, OR TO AN INTERMEDIATE PRODUCT, SUCH AS A REFINED METAL.) HISTORICALLY, U.S. EXPERIENCE WITH PRODUCT CONTROLS HAS BEEN MOST EXTENSIVE IN THE FIELDS OF FOREIGN TRADE (I.E., IMPORT TARIFFS AND QUOTAS) AND PRODUCT HEALTH AND SAFETY REGULATION (E.G., FOOD, DRUGS, FLAMMABLE MATERIALS, AND AUTOMOBILES). RECENT EXAMPLES IN THE FIELD OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION INCLUDE FEDERAL REGULATIONS ON THE PRODUCTION AND USE OF PESTICIDES, FEDERAL PRODUCT NOISE STANDARDS, AND STATE STANDARDS ON THE MAXIMUM SULFUR CONTENT OF FOSSIL FUELS.

IN THE SPECIFIC CONTEXT OF SOLID WASTE POLICY A WIDE VARIETY OF PRODUCT CONTROL PROPOSALS HAVE BEEN MADE. SOME OF THE MORE SIGNIFICANT OF THESE INCLUDE A (1) WEIGHT-BASED TAX (E.G., PENNY-A-POUND TAX) ON CONSUMER GOODS, (2) TAXES AND/OR BANS ON SPECIFIC TYPES OF PLASTICS (E.G., POLYVINYL CHLORIDE), (3) BANS ON PULLTAB BEVERAGE CANS, (4) BANS ON BIMETALLIC CANS, (5) RESTRICTIONS ON THE USE OF COPPER IN AUTOMOBILES, (6) DEVELOPMENT OF STANDARDS FOR DURABILITY OF CONSUMER APPLIANCES, (7) BANS OR TAXES ON THROWAWAY CONVENIENCE ITEMS, (8) ENVIRONMENTAL DEGRADABILITY STANDARDS FOR CERTAIN GOODS, (9) REGULATIONS GOVERNING THE MINIMUM RECYCLED MATERIAL CONTENT OF PRODUCTS (TYPICALLY PAPER PRODUCTS), (10) MANDATORY DEPOSIT REQUIREMENTS FOR BEVERAGE CONTAINERS. /2/

EVEN WITHIN THE SOLID WASTE FIELD, THE LIST OF ALL POSSIBLE PRODUCT CONTROLS THAT MIGHT BE CONCEIVED IS ALMOST INFINITE BECAUSE THERE ARE A GREAT MANY PRODUCT ATTRIBUTES THAT MIGHT BE TARGETED FOR REGULATION, AND THERE ARE ALSO USUALLY A LARGE NUMBER OF ALTERNATIVE POLICY TOOLS FOR ACHIEVING GIVEN OBJECTIVES. THUS, THE FIELD IS EXTREMELY COMPLEX, AND THE PRESENT CHAPTER CAN PROVIDE ONLY A CURSORY INTRODUCTION TO A SUBJECT THAT HAS ONLY RECENTLY COME UNDER CLOSE INVESTIGATION.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 023 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107117

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

/3/ APPENDIX C PRESENTS A DISCUSSION OF A SPECIFIC PRODUCT CONTROL DESIGNED TO INTERNALIZE THE COSTS OF SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT.

AS WITH OTHER FORMS OF INTERVENTION INTO THE PRIVATE MARKET SYSTEM, PRODUCT CONTROL POLICY DRAWS ITS THEORETICAL JUSTIFICATION FROM THE FAILURE OF PRIVATE MARKET DECISIONS TO ACHIEVE MAXIMUM SOCIAL WELFARE. ECONOMISTS HAVE LONG ARGUED THAT "OVERCONSUMPTION" OF PARTICULAR MATERIALS AND PRODUCTS WILL RESULT WHENEVER THE FULL SOCIAL COSTS OF PRODUCTION ARE NOT INTERNALIZED IN THE MARKET PRICE OF PRODUCTS. WHILE SOME ECONOMIC INCENTIVES EXIST TO CONSERVE RESOURCES (E.G., RISING MATERIAL AND ENERGY COSTS), IT HAS BEEN SUGGESTED THAT THE SOCIAL COSTS OF POLLUTION AND OTHER ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGES (ASSOCIATED WITH VARIOUS STAGES OF PRODUCTION, CONSUMPTION, AND POST-CONSUMER WASTE DISPOSAL) REPRESENT EVIDENCE OF PRIVATE MARKET FAILURE TO ADEQUATELY REFLECT AND BALANCE SOCIAL PRIORITIES. A BASIC QUESTION IS WHETHER PRIVATE MARKET PROCESSES CAN BE RELIED UPON TO SYSTEMATICALLY EVOLVE SOCIALLY OPTIMAL PRODUCT DESIGNS, INCLUDING ADEQUATE CONSIDERATION OF SUCH FACTORS AS PRODUCT DURABILITY, REPAIRABILITY, WASTE DISPOSAL COSTS, AND EASE OF MATERIAL RECOVERY FROM OBSOLETE OR DISCARDED ITEMS. LITTLE OR NO THEORETICAL OR EMPIRICAL ECONOMIC ANALYSIS EXISTS ON THE SUBJECT OF THE SOCIAL EFFICIENCY OF PRODUCT DESIGN. GENERAL OBSERVATIONS RAISE SOME QUESTIONS REGARDING PRODUCT DESIGN FROM A SOLID WASTE GENERATION/DISPOSAL/RECOVERY PERSPECTIVE; AND THESE PROVIDE EVIDENCE OF NEED FOR MORE DETAILED CONSIDERATION OF PRODUCT CONTROL POSSIBILITIES.

IN THIS CHAPTER, PRODUCT CONTROLS ARE CONSIDERED IN THE TWO SEPARE BUT RELATED CONTEXTS OF SOURCE REDUCTIONAND RESOURCE RECOVERY. SOURCE REDUCTION IS CONCERNED WITH REDUCING THE GENERATION OF SOLID WASTE BY SUCH MEANS AS REDUCING THE MATERIAL INTENSIVITY OF PRODUCTS; INCREASING PRODUCT DURABILITY, LIFETIME, OR REUSE; AND POSSIBLY BANNING OR REDUCING THE VOLUME OF CONSUMPTION OF CERTAIN PRODUCTS. PRODUCT CONTROLS TO ACHIEVE RESOURCE RECOVERY CAN INVOLVE IMPROVING THE RECYCLABILITY OR INCREASING SECONDARY MATERIAL CONTENT OF PRODUCTS TO ENHANCE BOTH TECHNICAL AND ECONOMIC FEASIBILITY OF RECOVERY.

TWO GENERAL CATEGORIES OF POLICY TOOLS ARE APPLICABLE IN THE PRODUCT CONTROL AREA; DIRECT REGULATORY MEASURES AND FISCAL APPROACHES. THESE TOOLS CAN BE USED FOR BOTH SOURCE REDUCTION OR RESOURCE RECOVERY PURPOSES. SOURCE REDUCTION REGULATIONS, FOR EXAMPLE, MIGHT INCLUDE SETTING STANDARDS FOR MINIMUM PRODUCT LIFETIME OR BANNING THE MANUFACTURE OF THROWAWAY PRODUCTS. REGULATIONS FOR RESOURCE RECOVERY MIGHT INCLUDE BANS ON THE BIMETALLIC CAN TO IMPROVE STEEL RECYCLING OR SETTING RECYCLED MATERIAL CONTENT SPECIFICATIONS FOR PAPER PRODUCTS TO INCREASE SECONDARY FIBER DEMAND. FISCAL MEASURES ALSO APPLY TO SOURCE REDUCTION, SUCH AS DISCRIMINATORY TAXES ON CERTAIN PRODUCTS OR MATERIALS. FISCAL MEASURES TO ENCOURAGE RESOURCE RECOVERY INCLUDE MONETARY INCENTIVES FOR THE USE OF SECONDARY MATERIALS, AS DISCUSSED IN CHAPTER 3.

THE MAJOR IMPLEMENTATION OPTIONS AVAILABLE ARE (1) TO INSTITUTE BROAD-BASED TAXES OR OTHER FINANCIAL INCENTIVES DESIGNED TO INTERNALIZE WASTE MANAGEMENT COSTS, /3/ LETTING THE MARKET SYSTEM MAKE THE APPROPRIATE ADJUSTMENTS; (2) TO TAX OR IMPOSE DEPOSITS ON SPECIFIC PRODUCTS HAVING A SIGNIFICANT SOURCE REDUCTION OR RESOURCE RECOVERY POTENTIAL; (3) TO REGULATE DIRECTLY CERTAIN PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTICS OF ALL PRODUCTS; (4) TO REGULATE SELECTED PRODUCTS OR MATERIAL COMPONENTS HAVING POTENTIALLY SIGNIFICANT SOURCE REDUCTION OR RESOURCE RECOVERY BENEFITS; (5) TO COMBINE REGULATORY AND FISCAL MEASURES INTO A COMPREHENSIVE SOURCE REDUCTION/RESOURCE RECOVERY APPROACH.

THE SELECTION OF A STRATEGIC PRODUCT CONTROL OPTION HAS IMPORTANT CONSEQUENCES IN THAT IT ESTABLISHES THE PHILOSOPHICAL BASIS OF THE APPROACH. SELECTIVE APPROACHES, WHERE INTERVENTION IS BY EXCEPTION, ARE DESIGNED TO S-LVE A PARTICULAR RECOGNIZED PROBLEM AND DO NOT ATTEMPT TO RESOLVE GENERAL PROBLEMS THAT ARE REFLECTED IN MANY PRODUCTS. SELECTIVE REGULATIONS OR INCENTIVES ARE RELATIVELY EASY TO IMPLEMENT BECAUSE THEY SINGLE OUT A PARTICULAR PROBLEM AS IT OCCURS IN RELATION TO A SPECIFIC PRODUCT. BROAD APPROACHES, ON THE OTHER HAND, ARE DIRECTED TOWARD THE RESOLUTION OF ISSUES AFFECTING MOST OR ALL MANUFACTURED PRODUCTS, SUCH AS THE POSSIBLE UNDERVALUATION BY THE PRIVATE MARKET SYSTEM OF VIRGIN RAW MATERIALS BECAUSE OF THE FAILURE OF SUPPLY PRICES TO INCLUDE THE FULL SOCIAL COSTS OF MATERIAL EXTRACTION AND PROCESSING. BECAUSE OF THEIR BREADTH, THEY ARE FAR MORE CUMBERSOME TO IMPLEMENT OR ARE LESS PRECISE IN THEIR EFFECTS. THEY RELY EITHER ON MARKET FORCES, WHICH MAY BE POORLY UNDERSTOOD, OR THEY NECESSITATE A LARGE, UNWIELDY ADMINISTRATIVE STRUCTURE TO IMPLEMENT.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 024 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107118

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

PRODUCT CONTROLS FOR SOURCE REDUCTION

SOURCE REDUCTION HAS BEEN DEFINED AS THE REDUCTION OF POST CONSUMER SOLID WASTE GENERATION EITHER BY ALTERING THE BASIC DESIGN, LIFETIME, OR USE PATTERN OF PARTICULAR CONSUMER GOODS OR BY CHANGING THE COMPOSITION OF SALES IN SUCH A WAY AS TO REDUCE THE WASTE VOLUEM ASSOCIATED WITH A GIVEN LEVEL OF AGGREGATE CONSUMER DEMAND. THUS DEFINED, SOURCE REDUCTION COULD CONCEIVABLY BE ACHIEVED BY METHODS OTHER THAN PRODUCT CONTROLS. THESE MIGHT INCLUDE EDUCATING OR PERSUADING CONSUMERS TO CHANGE THEIR FUNDAMENTAL CONSUMPTION HABITS OR IMPOSING A WASTE DISPOSAL CHARGES AT THE POINT OF WASTE GENERATION AS AN INDIRECT MEANS OF INFLUENCING CONSUMER PURCHASE AND PRODUCT USE DECISIONS. EPA STUDIES TO DATE HAVE BEEN DIRECTED TOWARD POSSIBLE PRODUCT CONTROL OPTIONS FOR ACHIEVING SOURCE REDUCTION OBJECTIVES. ONE OF THE MAIN REASONS FOR THIS CHOICE IS THAT A VERY LARGE NUMBER OR PRODUCT CONTROL PROPOSALS ARE CURRENTLY UNDER CONSIDERATION BY FEDERAL AND STATE LEGISLATURES. THIS SECTION DISCUSSES THE PRODUCTS THAT MAY BE SELECTED FOR SOURCE REDUCTION PURPOSES AND THE MECHANISMS THAT MAY BE UTILIZED FOR ACHIEVING SOURCE REDUCTION GOALS.

SELECTION OF PRODUCTS FOR SOURCE REDUCTION

SUBSTANTIAL DIFFICULTIES ARISE IN EVALUATING AND SELECTING PRODUCTS FOR SOURCE REDUCTION. ONE SUCH DIFFICULTY CONCERNS THE LEVEL OF SPECIFICITY AT WHICH THE PRODUCT CONTROL SHOULD BE PLACED. SHOULD SUCH A CONTROL ENCOMPASS ALL NONDURABLE PRODUCTS, A SPECIFIC PRODUCT CLASS (E.G., BEVERAGE CONTAINERS AND PAPER TOWELS). THE GREATER THE LEVEL OF DETAIL, THE MORE MANAGEABLE THE INDIVIDUAL CONTROL MEASURE AND THE MORE CLEAR ARE THE EFFECTIVENESS AND COSTS OF PARTICULAR ACTIONS. BUT FOCUSING ON PARTICULAR PRODUCTS RAISES EQUITY ISSUES WHEN OTHER PRODUCTS POSSESS SIMILAR CHARACTERISTICS AND MAKES THE OVERALL JOB HARDER BECAUSE MANY MORE SEPARATE JUDGMENTS HAVE TO BE MADE.

IN EVALUATING PRODUCTS FOR SOURCE REDUCTION, THE FOLLOWING CRITERIA APPEAR RELEVANT:

(1) IF A PRODUCT IS COMPOSED OF SCARCE MATERIAL, CONSIDER THE SUBSTITUTION OF A PRODUCT COMPOSED OF ABUNDANTLY AVAILABLE MATERIALS.

(2) IF A PRODUCT CAUSES DIFFICULTIES IN DISPOSAL, CONSIDER THE SUBSTITUTION OF A PRODUCT THE DISPOSAL OF WHICH WOULD BE LESS DIFFICULT.

(3) IF A PRODUCT HAS A SHORT LIFETIME, CONSIDER THE SUBSTITUTION OF A PRODUCT WITH A LONGER LIFETIME.

(4) IF A PRODUCT IS NOT REUSED, CONSIDER THE SUBSTITUTION OF A REUSABLE PRODUCT.

(5) IF A PRODUCT'S MATERIAL CONSUMPTION HAS GROWN WITHOUT CORRESPONDING GROWTH IN THE SERVICE THE PRODUCT DELIVERS, CONSIDER THE SUBSTITUTION OF A LESS MATERIAL-INTENSIVE PRODUCT.

(6) IF PRODUCT MANUFACTURE IS ENERGY OR POLLUTION INTENSIVE, CONSIDER THE SUBSTITUTION OF A PRODUCT THAT IS LESS ENERGY OR POLLUTION INTENSIVE.

IN ALL CASES, IN APPLICATION OF THESE CRITERIA, CONSIDERATION SHOULD BE MADE AS TO WHETHER MARKET PRICES CURRENTLY REFLECT FULL SOCIAL COSTS AND WHETHER OTHER SOCIAL CONTROL OPTIONS MAY NOT BE ABLE TO ACHIEVE THE SAME ENDS IN A MORE EFFICIENT AND/OR EQUITABLE MANNER. CARE MUST ALSO BE TAKEN TO AVOID THE UNNECESSARY INTRODUCTION OF OTHER UNDESIRABLE MARKET DISTORTIONS INTO THE MARKET DECISION PROCESSES. A MAJOR RESEARCH EFFORT IS CURRENTLY UNDERWAY THAT WILL ATTEMPT TO ANALYZE ALL MAJOR PRODUCTS IN SOLID WASTE IN RELATION TO ALL OR SOME OF THESE CRITERIA.

MECHANISMS TO ACHIEVE SOURCE REDUCTION

THERE ARE FOUR MAJOR TYPES OF MECHANISMS APPLICABLE TO SOURCE REDUCTION: TAXES OR CHARGES, DEPOSITS, BANS OR QUOTAS, AND DESIGN REGULATION. EVALUATION OF THESE OPTIONS REQUIRES ANALYSIS OF THE ABILITY OF THE OPTION TO ACHIEVE A DESIRED END RESULT, ANALYSIS OF THE ECONOMIC IMPACTS ON PRODUCERS AND CONSUMERS, ANALYSIS OF ENVIRONMENTAL AND SOCIAL IMPACTS, AND A DETERMINATION AND ASSESSMENT OF OVERALL COSTS AND BENEFITS.

PRODUCT TAXES OR CHARGES. -- PRODUCT TAXES OR CHARGES COULD BE USED FOR SOURCE REDUCTION PURPOSES IN SEVERAL WAYS. FOR EXAMPLE, PRODUCT CHARGES BASED ON THE WEIGHT OF A PRODUCT (IN ORDER TO PROVIDE AN INCENTIVE FOR WEIGHT REDUCTION) HAVE BEEN SUGGESTED. (SEE APPENDIX C.) OTHER EXAMPLES INCLUDE CHARGES BASED ON PRODUCT LIFETIME OR CHARGES ON A PARTICULAR USE OF A MATERIAL. THESE ARE FAIRLY BROAD-BASED MEASURES APPLICABLE TO WIDE CLASSES OF PRODUCTS. THEREFORE, DETERMINING THE APPROPRIATE LEVEL OF THE CHARGE AND PREDICTING EFFECTIVENESS AND IMPACTS ARE COMPLEX AND DIFFICULT TASKS.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 025 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107119

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

DEPOSITS. -- DEPOSITS, DESIGNED TO ENCOURAGE PRODUCT REUSE, MAY BE EFFECTIVE SOURCE REDUCTION MEASURES; HOWEVER, THEY ARE ONLY OF VALUE WHEN A REUSE OF RETURN SYSTEM EXISTS. THUS, DEPOSITS MAY APPLY IN THE BEVERAGE CONTAINER AREA WHERE REUSABLE CONTAINERS ARE AVAILABLE OR FOR TIRES WHEN RETREADING COULD TAKE PLACE. DEPOSIT MEASURES ARE THUS LIMITED IN SCOPE AND MAY BE VIEWED AS VIABLE MEASURES ONLY WHERE REUSABLE PRODUCTS ARE AVAILABLE. A DETAILED DISCUSSION OF BEVERAGE CONTAINER DEPOSIT SYSTEMS IS PROVIDED IN CHAPTER 5.

BANS. -- BANS COULD BE USED AS PRODUCT CONTROLS FOR SOURCE REDUCTION IF MATERIAL OR PRODUCT SUBSTITUTIONS WERE DESIRABLE. THEY COULD GENERALLY BE APPLIED ONLY IF ALTERNATIVE MATERIALS AND PRODUCTS EXIST. FOR EXAMPLE, BANS ON POLYVINYL CHLORIDE CONTAINERS COULD BE INSTITUTED ONLY IF OTHER CONTAINERS ARE AVAILABLE. THIS MECHANISM, LIKE THE DISPOSAL, IS THUS ALSO SOMEWHAT LIMITED TO SCOPE AND COULD ONLY BE USED ON A SELECTIVE BASIS.

DESIGN REGULATION. -- FROM A SOURCE REDUCTION PERSPECTIVE, DESIGN REGULATION COULD BE APPLICABLE TO THE EXTENSION OF THE LIFETIME OF SPECIFIC PRODUCTS AS WELL AS TO THE DESIGN OF PRODUCTS FOR REUSE OR DECREASED RESOURCE INTENSIVITY. THIS MECHANISM IMPLIES THAT A REGULATORY AUTHORITY WOULD SPECIFY THE DESIGN PARAMETERS FOR SPECIFIC PRODUCTS. THIS WOULD REQUIRE EXTENSIVE RESEARCH INTO PRODUCT DESIGN AND A FAIRLY EXTENSIVE BUREAUCRACY FOR ADMINISTRATION.

TO FURTHER ANALYZE PRODUCT CONTROL MECHANISMS FOR SOURCE REDUCTION, TWO STUDIES ARE CURRENTLY BEING UNDERTAKEN. IN THE FIRST OF THESE, PRODUCT-BY-PRODUCT REGULATORY APPROACHES RELATING TO EXISTING FEDERAL PROGRAMS IN PRODUCT HEALTH AND SAFETY ARE BEING ANALYZED TO ASSESS THE ADMINISTRATIVE REQUIREMENTS AND POTENTIAL EFFECTIVENESS OF DIRECT PRODUCT REGULATION. A SECOND STUDY TO DETERMINE THE DEMAND ELASTICITIES OF MAJOR PRODUCTS IN THE SOLID WASTE STREAM IS EXPECTED TO PROVIDE DATA ON THE POTENTIAL EFFECTIVENESS OF FISCAL MEASURES FOR SOURCE REDUCTION. THESE STUDIES SHOULD ASSIST IN THE EVALUATION OF PRODUCT CONTROL MEASURES TO REDUCE RESOURCE CONSUMPTION AND WASTE GENERATION.

PRODUCT CONTROLS FOR RESOURCE RECOVERY

PRODUCT CONTROL APPROACHES FOR RESOURCE RECOVERY COULD INCREASE THE RECYCLABILITY OF PRODUCTS BY MAKING IT EASIER (LESS COSTLY) TO SEPARATE AND RECOVER HIGH-QUALITY SECONDARY MATERIALS AND COULD ESTABLISH PRODUCT SPECIFICATIONS REQUIRING THE USE OF SECONDARY MATERIAL INPUTS. AS IN THE CASE OF SOURCE REDUCTION PRODUCT CONTROLS, TWO ISSUES ARE RAISED: SELECTION OF THE PRODUCTS TO BE CONTROLLED AND THE TYPES OF MECHANISMS THAT MIGH BE UTILIZED.

PRODUCT CONTROLS FOR RECYCLABILITY ARE CONCERNED WITH ELIMINATING MATERIALS OR PRODUCT CONFIGURATIONS THAT INHIBIT RECYCLING OR INCREASE THE COST OF RESOURCE RECOVERY. CASES WHERE RECYCLABILITY IS A PARTICULAR ISSUE INCLUDE THE BIMETALLIC (STEEL-ALUMINUM) CAN; RUBBER TIRES WITH TUNGSTEN STUDS, WHICH DO NOT SEPARATE BY MAGNETIC MEANS; ALUMINUM RINGS AROUND GLASS BOTTLES; AND COPPER CONTENT OF AUTOMOBILE SCRAP.

WITH RESPECT TO PRODUCT CONTROLS FOR SECONDARY MATERIAL CONTENT, ALL MAJOR PRODUCTS COULD BE THEORETICALLY CONSIDERED FOR CONTROL. HOWEVER, THERE ARE TECHNOLOGICAL LIMITATIONS (FOR EXAMPLE, IN PLASTICS RECYCLING), MATERIAL SUPPLY PROBLEMS, AND PRODUCT PERFORMANCE CONSIDERATIONS THAT CONSTRAIN THIS APPROACH.

THERE ARE TWO MAJOR TYPES OF REGULATORY MECHANISMS APPLICABLE TO RESOURCE RECOVERY PRODUCT CONTROLS; BANS AND STANDARDS. FISCAL INCENTIVE APPROACHES ARE DISCUSSES IN CHAPTER 3. BANS COULD BE UTILIZED TO REMOVE NONRECYCLABLE PRODUCT CONFIGURATIONS FROM THE MARKETPLACE OR ELIMINATE VIRGIN MATERIAL USE IN PARTICULAR PRODUCTS. STANDARDS COULD BE UTILIZED TO SET MINIMUM SECONDARY MATERIAL USE SPECIFICATIONS. IN THE FORM OF A GENERAL MANDATE COVERING ALL PRODUCTS, THIS LATTER MECHANISM WOULD REQUIRE ANALYSIS OF ALL PRODUCTS TO DETERMINE COMPONENT MATERIAL AND DESIGN POTENTIALS. SUCH AN ANALYSIS WOULD BE AN EXTREMELY COMPLEX PROJECT. ENFORCEMENT OF SUCH STANDARDS WOULD REQUIRE ESTABLISHMENT OF A LARGE ADMINISTRATIVE STRUCTURE. IF THE STANDARDS WERE SELECTIVE, ON THE OTHER HAND, ADMINISTRATIVE PROBLEMS WOULD DIMINISH SUBSTANTIALLY BUT EQUITY PROBLEMS MIGHT ARISE.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 026 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107120

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

THE CURRENT EXPERIENCE OF THE GENERAL SERVICES ADMINISTRATION IS SIGNIFICANT IN A DISCUSSION OF THIS TYPE OF PRODUCT CONTROL. (SEE CHAPTER 2.) THE GENERAL SERVICES ADMINISTRATION EXPERIENCE WITH SECONDARY FIBER SPECIFICATIONS IN PAPER PRODUCTS HAS BEEN VERY VALUABLE IN ESTABLISHING THE REQUIREMENTS AND PROCEDURES FOR PRODUCT CONTROLS FOR RECYCLED MATERIAL CONTENT.

CONCLUSIONS AND RECOMMENDATIONS

THE CONCEPT OF PRODUCT CONTROLS TO CONSERVE RESOURCES, REDUCE ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGE, AND REDUCE THE BURDEN OF DISPOSING OF SOLID WASTES IS ONE THAT SHOULD BE CAREFULLY CONSIDERED. THERE COULD BE IMPORTANT BENEFITS DERIVED FROM PRODUCT CONTROLS THAT IMPACT ON PRODUCERS AND CONSUMERS IN AN EQUITABLE MANNER (I.E., IN PROPORTION TO THEIR CONTRIBUTION TO ENVIRONMENTAL PROBLEMS) AND RESULT IN INCREASED OVERALL EFFICIENCY OF RESOURCE UTILIZATION, POLLUTION CONTROL, AND WASTE MANAGEMENT.

ON THE OTHER HAND, PRODUCT CONTROLS COULD HAVE PROFOUND IMPACTS ON THE MARKET SYSTEM BECAUSE THEY INVOLVE DIRECT CONTROL OF PRODUCT DESIGN OR CONSUMPTION LEVELS. THE EFFECT OF THESE MEASURES IS DIFFICULT TO PREDICT, AND HASTY ACTION COULD RESULT IN SIGNIFICANT ECONOMIC DISLOCATIONS. FOR THESE REAONS, IT IS IMPORTANT TO PROCEED VERY CAUTIOUSLY IN THIS AREA AND TO CONSIDER OPTIONS THAT ARE REASONABLE, FAIR, AND EQUITABLE.

AT PRESENT, THERE IS INSUFFICIENT INFORMATION TO EVALUATE THE NECESSITY OR DESIRABILITY OF PRODUCT CONTROL MEASURES. THEREFORE, TO BE ABLE TO MAKE APPROPRIATE RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE CONGRESS IN THIS AREA, IT IS RECOMMENDED THAT EPA, AS PART OF ITS RESEARCH AND ANALYSIS PROGRAM, CONTINUE TO STUDY PRODUCT CONTROLS FOR RESOURCE RECOVERY AND SOURCE REDUCTION PURPOSES. SEVERAL SUCH STUDIES ARE CURRENTLY UNDERWAY.

SENATOR DOMENICI. DO YOU THINK THIS IS A SALUTORY TREND? DO YOU THINK THERE IS ANY ROOM FOR ACTION BY THE CONGRESS THERE? AND, IF SO, WHAT DO YOU RECOMMENDF ANY OF YOU? WE WILL START OVER ON THE LEFT.

MR. SHEEHAN. I NOTICE THIS QUOTE THAT YOU JUST READ IN THE REPORT AND IT SEEMED TO ME THAT THE INTRODUCTION OF OUR SUPERMARKET SYSTEM MIGHT HAVE BEEN AN EFFORT TO ACHIEVE LABOR COST SAVINGS, SORT OF AUTOMATION IN THE DISTRIBUTION INDUSTRY, AND THAT AUTOMATION IS GOING TO CONTINUE. BUT THEN TO INDICATE THAT THE PACKAGING PROCESS OR DEVELOPMENT THAT HAS OCCURRED SINCE THEN COULD BE REVERSED AND OFFSET BY LOWER WAGES SO WE WOULD GET BACK TO THE NONSUPERMARKET TYPE OF DISTRIBUTION, AT LEAST AS THE REPORT MIGHT INDICATE, WOULD BE INCONSISTENT TO MY WAY OF THINKING.

WHAT I AM SUGGESTING HERE IS THAT ALTHOUGH YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE YOUR SUPERMARKET DISTRIBUTION SYSTEM, YOU MIGHT HAVE TO INDICATE THAT THAT TYPE OF ADVERTISING, THAT TYPE OF SALESMANSHIP, THAT TYPE OF PRESENTATION OF THE PRODUCT MAY HAVE TO BE CONTROLLED. IN OTHER WORDS, WE WILL HAVE OUR SUPERMARKETS BUT WE DON'T NEED AS MUCH PACKAGING AS WE ARE NOW WITNESSING.

I KNOW THAT RECENTLY, WHEN THE CONGRESS WAS DOING SOMETHING IN THE TRUTH-IN-PACKAGING BILL, THERE WAS QUITE A LOT OF THINKING IN THIS AREA -- IT IS INTERESTING, TO ME AT LEAST, THAT A NUMBER OF YEARS AGO WE MIGHT HAVE BEEN ON THE VERGE OF DOING SOMETHING IN THIS AREA. NEVERTHELESS, THERE WAS SUCH AN OPPOSITION TO THE PACKAGING PART OF THAT TRUGH-IN-PACKAGING BILL THAT IT WAS SCRAPPED BY THE CONGRESS. WE WERE TALKING THEN ABOUT STANDARDIZING THE PACKAGE, CUTTING BACK ON THE FLUFF IN THE PACKAGE; IT WAS MORE A CONSUMER FLUFF. WE MAY HAVE BEEN ONTO SOMETHING ELSE AT THAT TIME, THOUGH, AS I READ THIS NOW.

I THINK THAT PACKAGING FOR A VARIETY OF PURPOSES COULD BE CONTROLLED, BUT NOT AS A LABOR-SAVING DEVICE BECAUSE WE HAVE THAT AUTOMATION IN THE DISTRIBUTION INDUSTRY ANYHOW.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 027 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107121

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

SENATOR DOMENICI. I TAKE IT WHETHER OR NOT YOU FAVOR THE PROHIBITION OF CERTAIN PACKAGING AS A RESULT OF MINIMAL STANDARDS, THAT YOU SEEK ROOM FOR A GOOD DEFINITION OF ALTERNATE TYPES OF PACKAGING BY SOME ENTITY WHEREIN OBJECTIVITY WOULD AT LEAST BE THE ULTIMATE CONCLUSION. WHERE WE GO BEYOND IT, YOU HAVE BEEN INDICATED PERHAPS PROHIBITION WOULD BE IN ORDER.

THERE HAS BEEN MUCH OPPOSITION TO IT. AT LEAST YOU WOULD AGREE THAT WE HAVE TO EVALUATE, IS THAT CORRECT?

MR. SHEEHAN. I DO.

SENATOR DOMENICI. YOU WOULD NOT OBJECT TO THE PORTION OF THE BILL WHICH REQUIRES SOME MINIMAL PACKAGING EVALUATION. YOU MIGHT WANT TO EXPRESS YOURSELF ON WHAT KIND OF STANDARDS AND WHAT KIND OF INPUT THE ENTITY INVOLVED WOULD HAVE AND WHAT THEIR ULTIMATE POWER IS, BUT YOU SEE SOME ROOM FOR SOME OBJECTIVE EVALUATION?

MR. SHEEHAN. YES.

SENATOR DOMENICI. YOU CONCLUDE THE PRIVATE SECTOR IS NOT DOING THIS VOLUNTARILY?

MR. SHEEHAN. IT IS HARD FOR VOLUNTARY ACTION TO TAKE PART IN THAT.

SENATOR DOMENICI. DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMENT?

MR. MOORE. THIS CAME OUT PRIOR TO THE NATIONAL COMMISSION FOR MATERIAL POLICY CAME OUT WITH THEIR REPORT. THEY DIDN'T EVEN WAIT UNTIL THIS CAME OUT. NO. 1.

NO. 2 WHEN THEY REFER TO THE INCREASE IN THE PACKAGING INDUSTRY, THE TOTAL PROBLEM OF SOLID WASTE--I DON'T AGREE WITH WHAT THEY ARE SAYING. BASICALLY, IT IS ON THE INCREASE, BUT THE FACT IS THEY DON'T TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION THE BUILDING WASTE, THE INDUSTRIAL WASTE IN THE TOTAL PICTURE. THAT IS NOT TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION IN THE STATEMENT THEY MAKE HERE.

NO. 3, I OBJECT TO ANY STANDARDIZATION OF PRODUCTS OR PACKAGING IF IT IS GOING TO ELIMINATE JOBS. IN SOME OF THE BILLS THAT HAVE BEEN PUT UP, THEY HAVE SUGGESTED TO STANDARDIZE PACKAGING. IF THEY WERE TO GO INTO THE GLASS CONTAINER INDUSTRY AND STANDARDIZE THE BOTTLES OR CONTAINERS WE MANUFACTURE, THEY WOULD PUT US OUT OF WORK. WE DO NOT WANT TO ACCEPT IN ANY MANNER THE ELIMINATION OF OUR GOOD JOBS AT THE EXPENSE OF THE LITTER AND SOLID WASTE PROBLEMS, NO MATTER HOW IT COMES ABOUT, WHETHER IT BE STANDARDIZATION OF PRODUCTS OR WHAT. WE OBJECT TO THAT.

THERE HAVE TO BE OTHER WAYS AND MEANS IN WHICH WE CAN DO THIS WITHOUT KNOCKING OUR PEOPLE OUT OF WORK.

SENATOR DOMENICI. I DON'T WANT TO BE ARGUMENTATIVE, MR. MOORE, BUT I DON'T WANT TO LEAVE THIS WITHOUT ANY DIALOG. YOU ARE NOT SAYING THE PACKAGING INDUSTRY, AS IT AFFECTS THE EMPLOYEES YOU REPRESENT, IS AT A STATUS QUO THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE FOREVER RETAINED?

MR. MOORE. NO, I THINK WE CHANGE THE SIZES OF OUR PACKAGES BY THE GUY WHO COMES DOWN THE STORE. A GOOD EXAMPLE IS A LARGE CONTAINER FOR SOFT DRINKS. THIS THING HAS CAUGHT ON BECAUSE OF THE DEMAND OF THE PUBLIC.

SENATOR DOMENICI. AGAIN NOT BY THE WAY OF ARGUING, BUT JUST TO GET A FEW IDEAS IN THE RECORD, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THOSE REPRESENTING THE PLASTICS PACKAGING INDUSTRY HERE DIDN'T HAVE ANY EMPLOYEES THAT THEY REPRESENTED 30 YEARS AGO; WE HAD NOT PROGRESSED WITH THE CHEMICAL ANALYSIS OF THE CARBON CHAIN SUFFICIENTLY TO PRODUCE IT. THEY ARE NOW HERE WITH A SUBSTANTIAL NUMBER OF EMPLOYEES THAT ARE INVOLVED IN THAT INDUSTRY.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 028 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107122

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

YOU ARE NOT SAYING THAT THERE CANNOT BE CONSTRUCTIVE CHANGE IN THIS AREA WITHOUT A VOTE FROM EMPLOYMENT SECTOR, AND SOLID WASTE PROTECTION WITHOUT US EACH AND EVERY TIME FINDING OUT WHAT EMPLOYEES ARE MAKING ALUMINUM CANS, TIN CANS, OR PLASTIC PRODUCTS, ARE YOU?

MR. MOORE. NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT. IF YOU WANT TO GO BACK WHERE THEY BRING THE CHICKENS IN THE MARKET IN CAGES WITH THE FEATHERS AND HEAD ON -- WE DON'T WANT TO DO THAT.

SENATOR DOMENICI. A LOT OF PEOPLE WENT OUT TO WORK WHEN WE GOT RID OF THE CHICKEN CARRIERS.

MR. MOORE. PEOPLE GOT JOBS BECAUSE OF THE NEW TYPE OF PACKAGING WHICH BROUGHT THE PRODUCT TO THE MARKT IN A REASONABLE MANNER.

SENATOR DOMENICI. WEREN'T THERE ALOT OF PEOPLE WHO WERE DOING THAT AND AREN'T DOING THAT ANYMORE?

MR. MOORE. YES, BUT THERE WERE OTHER JOBS.

SENATOR DOMENICI. PERHAPS BY A DIFFERENT COMPANY IN A DIFFERENT CITY; IS THAT RIGHT?

MR. MOORE. THAT IS RIGHT.

SENATOR DOMENICI. LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT THE PLASTICS INDUSTRY FOR A MINUTE. MOST WITNESSES WHO HAVE TESTIFIED ON THIS SCORE HAVE INDICATED FOR THE MOST PART WASTE PLASTIC CANNOT BE RECOVERED FOR USE. YOU POINTED OUT SOME OF THE HAZARDS IN BURNING ONE PARTICULAR KIND.

DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEAS OR RECOMMENDATIONS AS TO THE BEST WAY OF GETTING BACK SOME OF THE VALUE IN WASTE PLASTIC? WHAT DOES THIS CONCERN YOU WITH IN THE TOTAL SECTOR OF SOLID WASTE DISPOSAL?

MR. MAZZOCCHI. WE CERTAINLY DON'T HAVE ANY BLUEPRINT FOR GETTING BACK -- I DOUBT THAT ANYBODY IS GOING TO COME BACK WITH RECYCLING PLASTIC. TIN CAN AND GLASS REPRESENT A TOTALLY DIFFERENT PROBLEM. IT IS AN ESTHETIC PROBLEM. IN PLASTIC DISPOSAL, YOU ARE DEALING WITH A DIFFERENT DIMENSION. IT JUST MAY BE THAT AFTER YOU EVALUATE IT, CERTAIN PRODUCTS CANNOT BE PRODUCED. WE HAVE A SLOGAN IN THE UNION: WE JUST DON'T INTEND TO BECOME OUR OWN UNDERTAKERS. WE SEE THAT HAPPENING. I THINK YOU TAKE YOUR LIFE IN YOUR HANDS EVERY TIME YOU DRINK WATER IN WASHINGTON, NOT FROM THE BACTERIOLOGICAL ASPECT, BUT I THINK THERE ARE ENOUGH CARCINOGENIC SUBSTANCES THAT HAVE BEEN INTRODUCED FROM THE UPSTREAM WATER SUPPLY. IF PEOPLE LOOKED AT THE WATER SUPPLY, IT WOULD FRIGHTEN THEM TO DEATH. IT WOULD FRIGHTEN YOU TO DEATH AS FAR AS THE CHILDREN ARE CONCERNED. YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT IT FROM HEALTH EFFECTS AND WORKERS IN THE COMMUNITY, AND WORKERS HAVE TO BE PROTECTED FROM JOB DISSOLUTION. TOO FEW BILLS ARE DEVELOPED WITHOUT CONSIDERATION TO WORKERS. YOU SAY A JOB HERE WILL BE REPLACED BY A JOB THERE. THE GUY WHO LOSES HIS JOB CANNOT BE TREATED AS AN ABSTRACTION.

YES, YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT PLASTIC PACKAGING. NOT EVERYTHING SHOULD HAVE PLASTIC WRAPPING, BECAUSE I THINK IN THE ULTIMATE ANALYSIS WE WILL SEE IN THE PROCESS OF PRODUCING AND PROCESS OF DISPOSING WE MAY KILL OFF AN AWFUL LOT OF PEOPLE.

SENATOR DOMENICI. SO THAT WE WILL HAVE THE RECORD CLEARED UP A LITTLE BIT ON OUR SARAN WRAP TESTIMONY, WE HAVE GENERAL TESTIMONY THAT IN SPITE OF THE PLASTICS PACKGING BEING NONRECYCLABLE, THAT IT IS GENERALLY A VERY GOOD SOURCE OF ENERGY IN THE KINDLING BOX FOR CONVERTING SOLID WASTE TO ENERGY, AND THE SCRUBBER TECHNOLOGY AND CLEANING UP TECHNOLOGY IS GETTING OUT THE POISON GASES IN THE INCENERATOR PROCESS. SARAN WRAP DOES NOT CREATE A SPECIFIC NEW PROBLEM OR DOES IT?

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 029 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107123

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

MR. MAZZOCCHI. I DON'T KNOW. WHY DO WE USE IT AS AN ILLUSTRATION? WHAT WE ARE SAYING IS THAT YOU NEED GUIDELINES AND CONTROLS BECAUSE WHATEVER YOU USE IT FOR, WE HOPE IT CAN BE DISPOSED OF PROPERLY AND USED AS YOU HAVE JUST MENTIONED, THAT CONTROLS WILL BE INSTITUTED. THE PRIVATE SECTOR USES IT ANY WAY IT WISHES WITHOUT ANY CONTROLS AND THE DEVIL TAKE THE HINDMOST, AND IN A RETROSPECTIVE VIEW, WE HAVE CAUSED AN AWFUL LOT OF DAMAGE, AND THEN COMES THE DISLOCATION. LET US LOOK AT ALL THE PROCESSES AND SEE HOW WE CAN SAFELY DISPOSE OF THE PRODUCT, RATHER THAN LEAVING IT TO CHANCE.

MR. SHEEHAN. BEFORE YOU GET OFF THE SUBJECT OF ENVIRONMENT AND THE JOB, I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE ANOTHER COMMENT. I THINK IT IS ONE THING TO TALK ABOUT THE ACTUAL LOSS OF JOBS THAT ARE NOW IN THE ECONOMY. IT IS ANOTHER ONE TO TALK ABOUT JOBS THAT MAY BE IN THE ECONOMY AT ANOTHER TIME. I GUESS IT IS VERY FASHIONABLE TO SAY THAT THE UNION MOVEMENT IS GOING TO PREVENT ANY ENVIRONMENTAL CORRECTIONS BECAUSE THEY ARE CONCERNED ABOUT JOB LOSSES, BUT I FOR ONE WOULD LIKE TO INDICATE THAT IN TERMS OF JOB PROTECTION, PROBABLY THE BEST FORM OF JOB PROTECTION IS SOME KIND OF REGULATION NOW THAT WILL PREVENT THE FUTURE LOSS OF JOBS.

I GIVE AS AN EXAMPLE OF THIS THE RESERVE MINING PELLETIZING PLANT IN MINNESOTA. IF THERE HAD BEEN AN ADEQUATE LAND USE POLICY 20 YEARS AGO, THAT PLANT WOULD HAVE BEEN BUILT 3 MILES INLAND. SO TODAY, REGARDING LAND USE POLICY, IT SEEMS TO ME THE LABOR MOVEMENT OUGHT TO BE ONE OF THE FOREMOST SUPPORTERS BECAUSE IT WILL PREVENT A LOSS OF JOBS IN THE FUTURE.

I HAVE HEARD A LOT ABOUT VINYL CHLORIDE HEARINGS. THERE IS ANOTHER BILL BEFORE THE CONGRESS ON TOXIC SUBSTANCES CONTROL. IF WE KNOW THE DANGERS NOW OF IMPAIRMENT OF HEALTH AT A FUTURE DATE, MAYBE THOSE INDUSTRIES SHOULD NOT DEVELOP AND SHOULD NOT BE BORNE WITH PEOPLE WHO ARE TIED DOWN TO JOBS FOR YEARS AND ARE COMMITTED TO HOMES, AND WITH CITIES WHICH GROW DEPENDENT UPON THE INDUSTRY. PERHAPS THIS PREVENTATIVE ACTION IS THE BEST JOB PROTECTION DEVICE WE COULD HAVE. YES, THE LABOR MOVEMENT IS CONCERNED ABOUT JOBS. THIS IS ONE OF THE BEST WAYS TO PROTECT THEM, BY MAKING SURE THERE WILL NOT BE AN ADVERSE IMPACT INTHE FUTURE ON THEM.

SENATOR DOMENICI. I DON'T WANT MR. MOORE TO CONCLUDE WE HAVE ANY BASIC AGREEMENT. WE DON'T. MY CONCERN IS THAT I DON'T THINK THE LABOR LEADERS OF THIS COUNTRY WANT TO BE LEFT WITH A POSITION BEFORE THIS COMMITTEE THAT IN THE WHOLE FIELD OF PACKAGING FROM TIN CANS ALL THE WAY THROUGH THE MORE REFINED THAT THEY ARE ON A STATUS QUO REGARDLESS OF WHAT A GOOD VERSUS BAD SOLID WASTE DISPOSAL PLAN FOR THIS COUNTRY INVOLVES, THE HECK WITH CHANGES. I DON'T THINK MR. MOORE IS SAYING THAT.

WHEN YOU CHANGE ONE THING, OBVIOUSLY, WE DON'T WANT TO DO IT OVERNIGHT. WE DON'T WANT TO PROHIBIT ANYTHING THAT WOULD GET RID OF THE JOBS OF THOSE PEOPLE YOU REPRESENT.

ON THE OTHER HAND, WE HAVE TO BE WILLING TO ACCEPT THAT THERE HAVE TO BE SOME CHANGES IN THE SOLID WASTE SYSTEM OF THIS COUNTRY, WHETHER IT COMES ABOUT VOLUNTARILY OR THROUGH MINIMUM REGULATIONS AND OUR INTENTIONS ARE THE SAME, I BELIEVE.

MR. MOORE. FOR YOUR INFORMATION, OUR INTERNATIONAL UNION HAS BEEN SPENDING OUR DUES DOLLARS, MONEY COMING OUT OF OUR COFFERS FOR THE NATIONAL CENTER FOR RESOURCE RECOVERY. OUR INTERNATIONAL PRESIDENT IS ON THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS. WE WANT TO DO SOMETHING. WE WERE THE FORERUNNERS. WE CAME ALONG LONG BEFORE THE DO-GOODERS. WE WERE DOING OUR PART THEN, AND WE WILL CONTINUE DOING OUR PART.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 030 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107124

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ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

I REPRESENT A LARGE NUMBER OF PLASTIC WORKERS IN THE UNITED STATES AND I THOUGHT I HEARD YOU SAY YOU CAN'T RECYCLE PLASTIC. THIS IS NOT TRUE. IN ONE PLASTIC INDUSTRY CAME ABOUT AS A DIRECT RESULT OF USING A BY PRODUCT OF THE OIL INDUSTRY AND THIS STUFF WAS BEING THROWN AWAY, AND NOW IT HAS BECOME A VALUABLE PART OF OUR LIVING STANDARDS. THE SUIT I HAVE ON TODAY -- THERE ARE PLASTICS IN THIS.

SENATOR DOMENICI. WE ARE NOT IN DISAGREEMENT ON THAT. THE WITNESSES WERE TESTIFYING IF YOU LOOKED AROUND THIS COUNTRY AND SAW THE DISTRIBUTION OF PLASTIC PACKAGING THROUGHOUT THE LARGE, SMALL, REMOTE AREAS AND BIG CITIES THAT IT WAS NOT ECONOMIC NOW TO CONSIDER A GUARANTEED BUY-BACK PLAN IN THAT AREA. THERE JUST WAS NOT THAT KIND OF USABILITY FOR THE MOST PART IN PLASTICS. AT THE SAME TIME, THEY HAVE INDICATED THE PLANT WASTE IN THE AREA OF PLASTICS WERE CERTAINLY BEING USED AND THIS WAS A SUBSTANTIAL INNOVATION.

I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE SPECIFIC CASE YOU ARE REFERRING TO, BUT THE RECORD CLEARLY INDICATES IT IS NOT AS REUSABLE AS ALUMINUM CANS, PAPER, STEEL AND IRON THAT IS OUT IN THE FIELD.

MR. MOORE. ONCE WE GET OUR RECYCLING STATIONS SET AROUND THE COUNTRY, WE CAN GET A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF PLASTICS BACK, AND IT WILL BE FEASIBLE TO CYCLE EVERY BIT. THEY ARE MAKING SEWER PIPES OUT OF GLASS.

SENATOR DOMENICI. MR. CHESTER.

MR. CHESTER. MR. CHAIRMAN, I WILL BE VERY BRIEF.

I NOTICED WHEN YOU WERE READING THE REPORT OF RESOURCE RECOVERY THAT CAME FROM CINCINNATI, THAT CAME FROM EPA.

SENATOR DOMENICI. NO.

MR. CHESTER. I WOULD LIKE TO INTERJECT A NOTE OF SERIOUS LEVITY. WE NOW HAVE TWO-DIGIT INFLATION AS OPPOSED TO WHEN THAT REPORT WAS WRITTEN, SO INFLATION IS CRUNCHING DOWN ON MANY, MANY PEOPLE AND CERTAINLY WORKERS ARE WELL AMONG THOSE PEOPLE THAT ARE GETTING THE CRUNCH.

SENATOR DOMENICI. I DIDN'T RECALL THAT I HAD READ THAT, BUT I DON'T DISAGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT AT ALL.

ANYONE ELSE WANT TO COMMENT?

MR. LABAFF. I AM INTERESTED IN YOUR LAST QUESTION. I THINK MR. SHEEHAN AND MR. MOORE HAVE COVERED YOUR QUESTION VERY WELL. WE ARE NOT HERE TO RESIST CHANGE, WE ARE HERE BECAUSE WE THINK THE ECONOMIC IMPACT WILL BE VERY SERIOUS. I THINK A UNION AS FAR AS ENVIRONMENT OR ANY OTHER FIELD IS CONCERNED HAS BEEN A LEADER. WE ARE HERE BECAUSE WE ARE CONCERNED THAT SOME OF OUR PEOPLE MAY LOSE THEIR JOBS AND TO THEM, THAT IS THE WORLD AND THAT IS WHY WE ARE HERE TODAY.

DENATOR DOMENICI. IF THAT WERE THE RESULT OF SOME ARBITRARY TYPE OF BAN, YOU CERTAINLY ARE HERE TO TELL US THAT THAT CERTAINLY DOESN'T MEET YOUR TEST OF GOOD JUDGMENT AND DISCRETION, I PRESUME.

MR. LABAFF. ABSOLUTELY.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 031 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107125

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

SENATOR DOMENICI. IF THERE IS NOTHING ELSE, THE COMMITTEE STANDS IN RECESS UNTIL 9:30 TOMORROW MORNING.

(WHEREUPON, AT 12:15 P.M., THE PANEL RECESSED, TO RECONVENE AT 9:30 A.M., TUESDAY, JULY 16, 1974.)

(THE FOLLOWING IS MR. CHESTER'S RESPONSE TO A QUESTION FROM SENATOR RANDOLPH ON P. 640.)

STONE, GLASS & CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE, WASHINGTON, D.C., JULY 25, 1974.

MR. PAUL CHIMES, COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC WORKS, NEW SENATE OFFICE BUILDING, WASHINGTON, D.C.

WITH REGARD TO THE SECOND QUESTION REFERRING TO CASES OF ENVIRONMENTAL BLACKMAIL AGAINST EMPLOYEES, I AM STILL ATTEMPTING TO GET SOME SPECIFICS ON THIS QUESTION. I WOULD SUGGEST, HOWEVER, THAT A SIMILAR REGULATION INVOLVING EMPLOYEE PROTECTION NOW AS PART OF THE FEDERAL WATER POLLUTION CONTROL ACT, COULD WELL BE ADOPTED AS A PART OF THE SOLID WASTE LEGISLATION BEING CONSIDERED BY THE PANEL ON MATERIALS POLICY, AND IN THAT REGARD, I AM ENCLOSING A COPY OF A LIST PUBLISHED BY EPA WHERE MANY COMPANIES ARE THREATENING TO CLOSE DOWN IN ALLEGING POLLUTION ABATEMENT COSTS TO BE A FACTOR. WITH BEST REGARDS, I AM

HOWARD P. CHESTER.

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 032 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107126

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

WHERE POLLUTION ABATEMENT COSTS ARE ALLEGED TO BE A FACTOR

TABLE OMITTED

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 033 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107127

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

PLANTS THREATENING TO CLOSE WHERE POLLUTION ABATEMENT COSTS ARE ALLEGED TO BE A FACTOR

TABLE OMITTED

STATEMENT OF SHEEHAN J J

STATEMENT OF ABEL J W

DWINDLING RESOURCES: A MYTH? 740715

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY 740715

PART 034 OF 34

SHEEHAN J J LEGISLATIVE DIRECTOR

ABEL J W PRESIDENT

NOSSITER B D

CHESTER H P EXECUTIVE SECRETARY

UNITED STEEL WORKERS OF AMERICA

WASHINGTON POST

STONE, GLASS AND CLAY COORDINATING COMMITTEE WASHINGTON, DC

107128

HEARINGS

TRANSCRIPT

ARTICLE CLIPPING

CORRESPONDENCE

PLANTS THREATENING TO CLOSE WHERE POLLUTION ABATEMENT COSTS ARE ALLEGED TO BE A FACTOR - CONTINUED

TABLE OMITTED

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY TUESDAY, 740716

STATEMENTS OF TAYLOR P, MATTHEWS J AND LANE L

S 2062 NONRETURNABLE BEVERAGE CONTAINER PROHIBITION ACT, 740507

STATEMENT OF MATTHEWS J

STATEMENT OF LANE L

TESTIMONY OF LANE L CONCERNING S 3549, S3723, S3560, S3277, 740716

SECTION 218

EMPLOYMENT IMPACT OF MANDATORY DEPOSIT CONTAINER USE

TESTIMONY BY CLUSEN RC, ON S3560, S3549, S3277, S3723, S1086, 740716

PART 001 OF 69

TAYLOR P

MATTHEWS J

LANE L

KIMBALL T L EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT

CLUSEN R C PRESIDENT

ENVIRONMENTAL ACTION, INC. WASHINGTON, DC

OREGON ENVIRONMENTAL COUNCIL PORTLAND, OR

SIERRA CLUB WASHINGTON, DC

NATIONAL WILDLIFE FEDERATION

LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS OF THE UNITED STATES

107129

HEARING

SENATE

TRANSCRIPT

THE PANEL MET AT 9:30 A.M., PURSUANT TO RECESS, IN ROOM 4200, DIRKSEN SENATE OFFICE BUILDING, HON. JENNINGS RANDOLPH (CHAIRMAN OF THE FULL COMMITTEE) PRESIDING.

PRESENT: SENATORS RANDOLPH, MUSKIE, STAFFORD, AND DOMENICI.

SENATOR RANDOLPH. A PLEASANT GOOD MORNING TO ALL OF YOU AS WE BEGIN OUR HEARING.

MS. TAYLOR, IF YOU WILL IDENTIFY YOURSELF FOR THE RECORD, AND THE ORGANIZATION FOR WHOM YOU SPEAK, AND THEN PROCEED AS YOU THINK BEST.

MS. TAYLOR. MY NAME IS PATRICIA TAYLOR, OF ENVIRONMENTAL ACTION, A NATIONAL ENVIRONMENTAL ORGANIZATION. I APPRECIATE THIS OPPORTUNITY TO PRESENT OUR VIEWS ON THE LEGISLATION BEFORE THE PANEL. ENVIRONMENTAL ACTION IS WORKING WITH CITIZENS AND ENVIRONMENTAL ORGANIZATIONS AROUND THE COUNTRY TO PROMOTE IMPROVED WASTE MANAGEMENT PRACTICES AND THE REDUCTION OF WASTE GENERATION. WE COMMEND THE SUBCOMMITTEE ON ENVIRONMENTAL POLLUTION FOR THE ESTABLISHMENT OF THIS PANEL ON MATERIALS POLICY. SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT IS INEXTRICABLY RELATED TO THE FORMULATION OF A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY.

BEFORE ADDRESSING THE SPECIFIC LEGISLATIVE PROPOSALS BEFORE THE PANEL, I WOULD LIKE TO BRIEFLY DISCUSS THE LEGISLATIVE HISTORY OF THE PROPOSED LEGISLATION.

WHEN CONGRESS ENACTED THE SOLID WASTE DISPOSAL ACT IN 1970, CITIZENS, LOCAL SOLID WASTE OFFICIALS, AND PRIVATE INDUSTRIES INVOLVED IN RECYCLING WERE HOPEFUL THAT FEDERAL RESOURCE AND SOLID WASTE POLICIES AND PRIORITIES WOULD BE CHANGED. THE PASSAGE OF THE RESOURCE RECOVERY ACT FOCUSED ATTENTION ON MATERIALS RECOVERY AS AN ALTERNATIVE TO LAND DISPOSAL FOR THE FIRST TIME IN THE NATION'S HISTORY.

THE EXTENSIVE RESEARCH CALLED FOR BY THE ACT, AS WELL AS DEMONSTRATION PROJECTS, WERE TO PROVIDE THE GROUNDWORK FOR THE PENDING LEGISLATIVE PROGRAM.

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY TUESDAY, 740716

STATEMENTS OF TAYLOR P, MATTHEWS J AND LANE L

S 2062 NONRETURNABLE BEVERAGE CONTAINER PROHIBITION ACT, 740507

STATEMENT OF MATTHEWS J

STATEMENT OF LANE L

TESTIMONY OF LANE L CONCERNING S 3549, S3723, S3560, S3277, 740716

SECTION 218

EMPLOYMENT IMPACT OF MANDATORY DEPOSIT CONTAINER USE

TESTIMONY BY CLUSEN RC, ON S3560, S3549, S3277, S3723, S1086, 740716

PART 002 OF 69

TAYLOR P

MATTHEWS J

LANE L

KIMBALL T L EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT

CLUSEN R C PRESIDENT

ENVIRONMENTAL ACTION, INC. WASHINGTON, DC

OREGON ENVIRONMENTAL COUNCIL PORTLAND, OR

SIERRA CLUB WASHINGTON, DC

NATIONAL WILDLIFE FEDERATION

LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS OF THE UNITED STATES

107130

HEARING

SENATE

TRANSCRIPT

ALTHOUGH EPA IS TO BE COMMENDED FOR MUCH OF THE EXCELLENT RESEARCH THAT HAS BEEN CARRIED OUT OVER THE PAST 4 YEARS, MANY OF THE AGENCY'S EFFORTS HAVE BEEN EXTREMELY DISAPPOINTING.

THERE HAS BEEN A CONSISTENT ATTEMPT BY THE ADMINISTRATION TO UNDERMINE MANY OF THE PROGRAMS I BELIEVE WERE ENVISIONED BY THE CONGRESS WHEN THE RESOURCE RECOVERY ACT WAS ENACTED IN 1970.

FOR EXAMPLE, 1 1/2 YEARS AGO, THE ADMINISTRATION ATTEMPTED TO REFOCUS ALL FEDERAL SOLID WASTE PROGRAMING ON HAZARDOUS WASTES. BUDGETING A MERE $5.8 MILLION FOR THE ENTIRE FEDERAL EFFORT, ADMINISTRATION OFFICIALS DECLARED THAT MUNICIPAL WASTE MANAGEMENT AND RESOURCE RECOVERY WERE LOCAL PROBLEMS.

INDEED THEY ARE LOCAL PROBLEMS. LOCAL GOVERNMENTS PRESENTLY BEAR OVER 98 PERCENT OF THE COST OF SOLID WASTE COLLECTION AND DISPOSAL. IT IS ALSO LOCAL DISPOSAL FACILITIES THAT ARE OVERBURDENED WITH WASTES RESULTING FROM NATIONAL POLICIES WHICH INHIBIT THE UTILIZATION OF SECONDARY MATERIALS. NATIONAL CONSUMPTION AND PRODUCTION PRACTICES HAVE ALSO RESULTED IN AN EVER-INCREASING RATE OF WASTE GENERATION. THE RESOURCE RECOVERY ACT, I BELIEVE, WAS ENACTED TO ADDRESS THESE ISSUES, AS WELL AS THOSE OF HAZARDOUS WASTE MANAGEMENT.

THE CONGRESS TRIED TO REVERSE THE ADMINISTRATION'S ACTION BY RAISING THE LEVEL OF FUNDING TO $14.8 MILLION AND INCREASING AGENCY STAFFING. HOWEVER, 60 OF THE POSITIONS AUTHORIZED BY THE CONGRESS REMAIN UNFILLED. LOCAL GOVERNMENTS ARE SUFFERING UNDER THIS LACK OF ADMINISTRATION COMMITMENT TO DEAL WITH THE PROBLEMS ASSOCIATED WITH WASTE. THE NATION AND THE ENVIRONMENT ALSO CONTINUE TO SUFFER AS MATERIALS ARE DISPOSED OF AND PRODUCED WITHOUT CONSIDERATION OF REUSE OR RECOVERY POTENTIAL.

THESE MOVES BY THE ADMINISTRATION TO REDUCE FUNDING AND STAFFING AS WELL AS REORIENT THE ENTIRE PROGRAM ARE BUT ONE EXAMPLE OF THE METHODS WHICH HAVE BEEN EMPLOYED TO THWART THE INTENT OF THE RESOURCE RECOVERY ACT. THE ACT HAS BEEN POORLY IMPLEMENTED AS WELL. FOR EXAMPLE, SECTION 209 STATES, "THE SECRCTARY SHALL RECOMMEND TO APPROPRIATE AGENCIES AND PUBLISH IN THE FEDERAL REGISTER GUIDELINES FOR SOLID WASTE RECOVERY, COLLECTION, SEPARATION AND DISPOSAL SYSTEMS." IN APRIL 1973, ALMOST 3 YEARS AFTER ENACTMENT, PROPOSED GUIDELINES FOR LANDFILL AND INCINERATION OF SOLID WASTE WERE PUBLISHED IN THE FEDERAL REGISTER. FINAL GUIDELINES ARE YET TO BE PROMULGATED.

ANOTHER IMPORTANT SECTION OF THE ACT, SECTION 211, REQUIRES EXECUTIVE AGENCY COMPLIANCE WITH ALL GUIDELINES PROMULGATED UNDER SECTION 209. TO DATE, I -NOW OF NO PLANS FOR IMPLEMENTATION OF SECTION 211. IT IS APPALLING TO REALIZE THAT FEDERAL AGENCIES CONTINUE TO OPERATE OPEN DUMPS ON FEDERAL LANDS ACROSS THE NATION. "THE NEED FOR FEDERAL AGENCIES TO IMPROVE SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT PRACTICES.

ON JUNE 5, 1971, THE NATIONAL RESOURCES DEFENSE COUNCIL, THE SIERRA CLUB, AND ENVIRONMENTAL ACTION FILED SUIT IN U.S. DISTRICT COURT AGAINST THE U.S. ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY AND THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT FOR THEIR FAILURE TO CARRY OUT THESE KEY PROVISIONS OF THE RESOURCE RECOVERY ACT.

ATTEMPTS SUCH AS THOSE WHICH HAVE BEEN MADE BY THE ADMINISTRATION TO CURTAIL FEDERAL INVOLVEMENT IN SEEKING SOLUTIONS TO THE SOLID WASTE PROBLEM SERVE NO OTHER PURPOSE THAN TO FURTHER EXACERBATE THE CRITICAL ENERGY AND MATERIALS WASTE ASSOCIATED WITH PRESENT SOLID WASTE GENERATION AND DISPOSAL PRACTICES.

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY TUESDAY, 740716

STATEMENTS OF TAYLOR P, MATTHEWS J AND LANE L

S 2062 NONRETURNABLE BEVERAGE CONTAINER PROHIBITION ACT, 740507

STATEMENT OF MATTHEWS J

STATEMENT OF LANE L

TESTIMONY OF LANE L CONCERNING S 3549, S3723, S3560, S3277, 740716

SECTION 218

EMPLOYMENT IMPACT OF MANDATORY DEPOSIT CONTAINER USE

TESTIMONY BY CLUSEN RC, ON S3560, S3549, S3277, S3723, S1086, 740716

PART 003 OF 69

TAYLOR P

MATTHEWS J

LANE L

KIMBALL T L EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT

CLUSEN R C PRESIDENT

ENVIRONMENTAL ACTION, INC. WASHINGTON, DC

OREGON ENVIRONMENTAL COUNCIL PORTLAND, OR

SIERRA CLUB WASHINGTON, DC

NATIONAL WILDLIFE FEDERATION

LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS OF THE UNITED STATES

107131

HEARING

SENATE

TRANSCRIPT

IN LIGHT OF THIS HISTORY, WE COMMEND THE PANEL FOR ITS DECISION TO HOLD THESE HEARINGS. WE FEEL THAT IT IS PARTICULARLY URGENT THAT THE CONGRESS STEP IN AND PROVIDE A CLEARLY DEFINED MANDATE AND DIRECTION TO FEDERAL SOLID WASTE PROGRAMING. WE AGREE WITH THE PANEL THAT SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT MUST BE ADDRESSED IN A BROADER CONTEXT OF A NATIONAL MATERIALS AND ENERGY POLICY. AN IMPORTANT PART OF THAT POLICY IS A BASIC UNDERSTANDING OF PRESENT MATERIALS AND ENERGY CONSUMPTION TRENDS, THEIR IMPACT ON THE ENVIRONMENT AND THE POTENTIAL FOR REVERSING POLICIES AND PRACTICES WHICH ENCOURAGE NEEDLESS WASTE.

UNFORTUNATELY, THE NATIONAL COMMISSION ON MATERIALS POLICY, IN ITS REPORT TO THE CONGRESS, DID NOT MAKE A THOROUGH ENOUGH EVALUATION. RATHER, THE COMMISSION SEEMS TO HAVE MADE AN INITIAL ASSUMPTION OF THE NEED FOR MAINTAINING PRESENT LEVELS OF CONSUMPTION AND SOUGHT TO MEET THAT DEMAND IN WHATEVER WAY POSSIBLE, IN SOME INSTANCES RECOMMENDING POLICY CHANGES TO ENCOURAGE THE EXPANDED UTILIZATION OF RECOVERED MATERIALS. WE BELIEVE THAT THE CONGRESS MUST ADDRESS SOME OF THE UNDERLYING PATTERNS OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT WHICH HAVE MADE THE U.S. ECONOMY THE MOST RESOURCE- AND ENERGY-INTENSIVE ECONOMY IN THE WORLD.

IN A STATEMENT BEFORE THE SENATE INTERIOR COMMITTEE CONCERNING THE COMMISSION'S REPORT. PROFESSOR NATHANIEL WELLMAN OF THE UNIVERSITY OF NEW MEXICO, CALLED ITS BASIC OPERATING PREMISE INTO QUESTION.

HE STATED:

UNLESS THE TOTAL OF MATERIALS USE IS REDUCED, OUR ENVIRONMENTAL PROBLEMS WILL CONTINUE TO GROW. BY SUBSTITUTING LABOR FOR MATERIALS IN CERTAIN STRATEGIC SECTORS OF THE ECONOMY, MATERIAL THROUGHOUT IS REDUCED WITHOUT A CORRESPONDING DECLINE IN THE OUTPUT OF FINAL GOODS. THE INCREASED LABOR NEEDED FOR ENVIRONMENTALLY DESIRABLE OR NEUTRAL PRODUCTS WILL COME FROM THE REDUCTION IN PRODUCTION OF ENVIRONMENTALLY DAMAGING GOODS AND FROM THE POOL OF UNEMPLOYED AND PARTIALLY EMPLOYED LABOR.

THE SHIFT AWAY FROM A LABOR TO A MATERIALS- AND ENERGY-INTENSIVE MEANS OF DELIVERING GOODS TO THE CONSUMER HAS HAD AN IMPACT BOTH ON THE ENVIRONMENT AND THE LABOR FORCE. IN THE MARCH 1974, ISSUE OF FORTUNE, SANFORD ROSE, IN AN ARTICLE ENTITLED "THE FAR REACHING CONSEQUENCES OF HIGH-PRICED OIL," EXAMINED THE IMPACT OF DECREASED ENERGY CONSUMPTION RESULTING FROM HIGHER ENERGY COSTS ON LABOR. USING THE EXAMPLE OF RETURNABLE, REFILLABLE VERSUS THROWAWAY CONTAINER USE, MR. ROSE EXEMPLIFIED WHAT HE CALLS "ONE LONG-TERM CONSEQUENCE OF RISING ENERGY PRICES: THE NUMBER OF JOB OPPORTUNITIES WILL INCREASE MORE RAPIDLY THAN WOULD OTHERWISE HAVE BEEN THE CASE."

LOOKING AT THE BREWING INDUSTRY, WE CAN EXAMINE THE ENVIRONMENTAL AND EMPLOYMENT IMPACT OF THE SHIFT TO A MORE MATERIALS AND ENERGY INTENSIVE MEANS OF DELIVERING GOODS TO THE CONSUMER. IN THE PERIOD BETWEEN 1958 AND 1970, THE RAPID CHANGEOVER TO ONE-WAY PACKAGING WAS WELL UNDERWAY IN THE MALT LIQUOR INDUSTRY. IN 1958, 42.3 PERCENT OF ALL BEER FILLINGS WERE IN NONRETURNABLE CANS AND BOTTLES. BY 1971, 76.1 PERCENT OF THE FILLINGS WERE IN NONRETURNABLES. ACCORDING TO THE U.S. ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY, 410,000 TONS OF GLASS, 896,000 TONS OF STEEL AND NO ALUMINUM WERE UTILIZED IN THE PRODUCTION OF BEER CONTAINERS IN 1958. BY 1970, WHEN 76.1 PERCENT OF THE FILLINGS WERE IN NONRETURNABLE CONTAINERS, 1,912,500 TONS OF GLASS, 945,000 TONS OF STEEL, AND 273,000 TONS OF ALUMINUM WERE CONSUMED IN BEER CONTAINER PRODUCTION.

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY TUESDAY, 740716

STATEMENTS OF TAYLOR P, MATTHEWS J AND LANE L

S 2062 NONRETURNABLE BEVERAGE CONTAINER PROHIBITION ACT, 740507

STATEMENT OF MATTHEWS J

STATEMENT OF LANE L

TESTIMONY OF LANE L CONCERNING S 3549, S3723, S3560, S3277, 740716

SECTION 218

EMPLOYMENT IMPACT OF MANDATORY DEPOSIT CONTAINER USE

TESTIMONY BY CLUSEN RC, ON S3560, S3549, S3277, S3723, S1086, 740716

PART 004 OF 69

TAYLOR P

MATTHEWS J

LANE L

KIMBALL T L EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT

CLUSEN R C PRESIDENT

ENVIRONMENTAL ACTION, INC. WASHINGTON, DC

OREGON ENVIRONMENTAL COUNCIL PORTLAND, OR

SIERRA CLUB WASHINGTON, DC

NATIONAL WILDLIFE FEDERATION

LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS OF THE UNITED STATES

107132

HEARING

SENATE

TRANSCRIPT

THUS, THE SWITCH TO ONE-WAY PACKAGING SUBSTANTIALLY INCREASED MATERIAL DEMAND TO DELIVER MALT LIQUOR TO THE CONSUMER. IN ADDITION TO INCREASED MATERIAL CONSUMPTION, THE SWITCH TO ONE-WAY CONTAINER USE HAS CREATED ADDITIONAL BURDENS ON THE ENVIRONMENT; INCREASED ENERGY CONSUMPTION, SOLID WASTE, AND LITTER.

IN TERMS OF ACTUAL CONTAINER PRODUCTION, 14.1 BILLION MORE CONTAINERS WERE PRODUCED IN 1971 THAN IN 1958 FOR BEER PACKAGING. ONE WOULD EXPECT THAT THIS PHENOMENAL GROWTH IN CONTAINER PRODUCTION WOULD BE ACCOMPANIED BY A RAPIDLY EXPANDING LABOR FORCE. HOWEVER, THIS HAS NOT BEEN THE CASE.

AS MR. ROSE POINTS OUT FURTHER IN HIS ARTICLE. "THE MORE COMPLEX AN INDUSTRIAL SOCIETY BECOMES, THE MORE IT LEARNS HOW TO ORGANIZE ELECTRICAL, MECHANICAL, THERMAL, OR NUCLEAR MEANS OF DOING THE WORK THAT MEN ONCE DID WITH HANDS."

THE BREWING INDUSTRY, AS MR. SELLINGER TESTIFIED EARLIER, HAS UNDERGONE A DRAMATIC CHANGE IN STRUCTURE, MUCH OF IT THE RESULT OF ONE-WAY CONTAINER USE. IN 1952, THERE WERE 357 BREWERIES IN THE UNITED STATES. PRESENTLY THERE ARE LESS THAN 100. FOR THE LABOR FORCE, THE SWITCH TO ONE-WAY PACKAGING HAS HAD A DISASTROUS IMPACT. THERE WAS A 26-PERCENT DECREASE IN EMPLOYMENT IN THE MALT LIQUOR INDUSTRY BETWEEN 1958 AND 1971. IN 1958, 71,700 PEOPLE WERE EMPLOYED IN THE INDUSTRY. BY 1971, THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE EMPLOYED IN THE MALT LIQUOR INDUSTRY HAD DROPPED DRAMATICALLY TO ONLY 57,000.

(A TABULATION FOLLOWS:)

EMPLOYMENT IN THE MALT LIQUOR INDUSTRY

TABLE OMITTED

SOURCE: 1958 CENSUS OF MANUFACTURERS, 1967 CENSUS OF MANUFACTURERS, ANNUAL SURVEY OF MANUFACTURERS -- 1971; EMPLOYMENT AND LABOR COSTS FOR OPERATING MANUFACTURING ESTABLISHMENT, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE, SOCIAL AND ECONOMIC ADMINISTRATION, BUREAU OF CENSUS.

MS. TAYLOR. MR. CHAIRMAN, THESE ARE CHANGES IN EMPLOYMENT ONLY WITHIN THE MALT LIQUOR INDUSTRY WHICH HAVE RESULTED FROM THE SWITCH TO THE MATERIALS AND ENERGY INTENSIVE ONE-WAY BEVERAGE CONTAINER. IN ADDITION TO THESE POSITIONS, WORKERS IN THE DISTRIBUTION AND RETAIL SECTORS OF THE ECONOMY HAVE ALSO BEEN NEGATIVELY IMPACTED.

MR. CHAIRMAN, HEARINGS ON NATIONAL BEVERAGE CONTAINER LEGISLATION WERE HELD BY THE SENATE COMMERCE COMMITTEE MAY 6 AND 7 OF THIS YEAR. AT THAT TIME WE PRESENTED IN GREAT DETAIL THE CASE FOR PASSAGE OF SUCH A MEASURE BY THE CONGRESS. RATHER THAN PRESENT SIMILAR TESTIMONY TODAY, I HAVE ATTACHED A COPY OF OUR TESTIMONY FOR YOUR INFORMATION. (SEE P. 688.)

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY TUESDAY, 740716

STATEMENTS OF TAYLOR P, MATTHEWS J AND LANE L

S 2062 NONRETURNABLE BEVERAGE CONTAINER PROHIBITION ACT, 740507

STATEMENT OF MATTHEWS J

STATEMENT OF LANE L

TESTIMONY OF LANE L CONCERNING S 3549, S3723, S3560, S3277, 740716

SECTION 218

EMPLOYMENT IMPACT OF MANDATORY DEPOSIT CONTAINER USE

TESTIMONY BY CLUSEN RC, ON S3560, S3549, S3277, S3723, S1086, 740716

PART 005 OF 69

TAYLOR P

MATTHEWS J

LANE L

KIMBALL T L EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT

CLUSEN R C PRESIDENT

ENVIRONMENTAL ACTION, INC. WASHINGTON, DC

OREGON ENVIRONMENTAL COUNCIL PORTLAND, OR

SIERRA CLUB WASHINGTON, DC

NATIONAL WILDLIFE FEDERATION

LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS OF THE UNITED STATES

107133

HEARING

SENATE

TRANSCRIPT

BEVERAGE CONTAINER LEGISLATION HAS PLAYED A VERY PROMINENT ROLE IN THESE HEARINGS ON COMPREHENSIVE SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT BECAUSE THE OREGON BOTTLE BILL HAS BECOME A KIND OF TEST CASE FOR THE SOURCE REDUCTION APPROACH TO SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT. WE STRONGLY SUPPORT HIS WAY OF LOOKING AT SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT FOR A NUMBER OF REASONS.

SOURCE REDUCTION IS A POLICY OPTION WHICH WILL HAVE SIGNIFICANT IMPACT BY REDUCING THE AMOUNT OF WASTES GENERATED, MAKING POSSIBLE SAVINGS IN SPACE AT LAND DISPOSAL SITES. THIS IMPACT IS OF SPECIAL IMPORTANCE TO MUNICIPALITIES FACED WITH LIMITED LIFETIME AT EXISTING DISPOSAL SITES. FOR MUNICIPALITIES TRANSPORTING WASTES FOR DISPOSAL ANY DISTANCE, TRANSPORTATION COSTS AS WELL AS LAND SPACE SAVINGS WILL BE ACHIEVED.

SOURCE REDUCTION TECHNIQUES WILL ALSO REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF WASTES THAT NEED TO BE COLLECTED, THUS MAKING SAVINGS IN COLLECTION COSTS, THE MOST EXPENSIVE PART OF LOCAL SOLID WASTE EXPENDITURES, POSSIBLE. THESE SAVINGS ARE CONTINGENT, HOWEVER, ON INCREASED EFFICIENCY IN COLLECTION PROCEDURES AS A RESULT OF THE DECREASED WASTE GENERATION.

SOURCE REDUCTION TECHNIQUES ALSO POSITIVELY IMPACT THE NATION'S MATERIALS AND ENERGY CONSUMPTION PATTERNS, RESULTING IN SIGNIFICANT CONSERVATION OF BOTH.

SOMETIMES RESOURCE RECOVERY AND SOURCE REDUCTION ARE PRESENTED IN THE CONTEXT OF EITHER/OR. THIS IS MOST UNFORTUNATE, FOR WE ARE NOT AGAINST THE POSITIVE IMPACT OF RECOVERY OF MATERIALS FROM WASTE' WHAT WE DO BELIEVE IS THAT WE SHOULD FIRST TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT WE ARE PRODUCING AND SEE WHAT CAN BE REDUCED -- THROUGH PRODUCT LONGEVITY, PRODUCT REUSE, OR PRODUCT REDESIGN. AFTER ALL POSSIBLE AVENUES FOR WASTE REDUCTION HAVE BEEN EXPLORED, THEN WE CAN ENCOURAGE THE RECOVERY OF WHATEVER RESOURCES REMAIN.

WHAT IS SIMPLY FRIGHTENING TO US IS A POSSIBLE SCENARIO OF INSTITUTIONALIZING WASTE GENERATION. ONCE A MUNICIPALITY INVESTS A LARGE SUM OF TAXPAYER MONEY IN MATERIALS RECOVERY FACILITY CONSTRUCTION -- DEPENDENT UPON A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF REFUSE TO KEEP IT OPERATING EFFICIENTLY -- MUCH OF THE INCENTIVE FOR WASTE REDUCTION WILL BE REMOVED. AS A MATTER OF FACT, WE ARE CONCERNED THAT MANY OF THE EFFORTS DIRECTED AT ENCOURAGING THE RECOVERY OF MATERIALS FROM WASTE MAY BE UNDERTAKEN TO CIRCUMVENT THE POSSIBILITY OF SOURCE REDUCTION PROGRAMING.

I WOULD LIKE TO BRIEFLY PROVIDE AN EXAMPLE IN THIS AREA. THE NATIONAL CENTER FOR RESOURCE RECOVERY HAS ENETERED INTO A CONTRACT WITH THE CITY OF NEW ORLEANS FOR A RESOURCE RECOVERY PROGRAM, MR. CHAIRMAN. PART OF THAT CONTRACT SPECIFICALLY PROHOBITS THE CITY OF NEW ORLEANS FROM UNDERTAKING ANY SOURCE REDUCTION EFFORTS.

TO COMPARE THE IMPACTS OF RECYCLING WITH SOURCE REDUCTION, I WOULD LIKE TO SHARE WITH YOU INFORMATION FROM A REPORT PREPARED FOR THE CALIFORNIA STATE ASSEMBLY'S COMMITTEE ON NATURAL RESOURCES AND CONSERVATION ENTITLED "THE CALIFORNIA LITTER PROBLEM -- A REVIEW." IN THEIR STUDY, E. KALLAK AND D. SYREK COMPARED THE ENERGY CONSUMPTION REQUIREMENTS OF RECYCLING AND REUSING BEVERAGE CONTAINERS. THEY DETERMINED THAT, EVEN WITH 100-PERCENT RECYCLING OF GLASS BEVERAGE CONTAINERS, IT WOULD REQUIRE MORE ENERGY TO DELIVER BEVERAGE TO THE CONSUMER IN ONE-WAY CONTAINERS THAN IN A FOUR-TRIP REFILLABLE CONTAINER. WHAT IS EVEN MORE DISTRUBING WHEN ONE LOOKS CLOSELY AT THE ATTACHED CHART IS TO REALIZE THAT WE ARE NOWHERE NEAR APPROACHING 100 PERCENT RECYCLING OF GLASS BEVERAGE CONTAINERS.

NEED FOR A NATIONAL MATERIALS POLICY TUESDAY, 740716

STATEMENTS OF TAYLOR P, MATTHEWS J AND LANE L

S 2062 NONRETURNABLE BEVERAGE CONTAINER PROHIBITION ACT, 740507

STATEMENT OF MATTHEWS J

STATEMENT OF LANE L

TESTIMONY OF LANE L CONCERNING S 3549, S3723, S3560, S3277, 740716

SECTION 218

EMPLOYMENT IMPACT OF MANDATORY DEPOSIT CONTAINER USE

TESTIMONY BY CLUSEN RC, ON S3560, S3549, S3277, S3723, S1086, 740716

PART 006 OF 69

TAYLOR P

MATTHEWS J

LANE L

KIMBALL T L EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT

CLUSEN R C PRESIDENT

ENVIRONMENTAL ACTION, INC. WASHINGTON, DC

OREGON ENVIRONMENTAL COUNCIL PORTLAND, OR

SIERRA CLUB WASHINGTON, DC

NATIONAL WILDLIFE FEDERATION

LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS OF THE UNITED STATES

107134

HEARING

SENATE

TRANSCRIPT

RATHER, IN 1973, APPROXIMATELY 3 PERCENT OF THE GLASS BEVERAGE CONTAINERS PRODUCED WERE RECYCLED ACCORDING TO THE GLASS CONTAINER MANUFACTURERS INSTITUTE.

(THE CHART FOLLOWS:)

CHART OMITTED

MS. TAYLOR. WHY SHOULD TAXPAYERS FINANCE RESOURCE RECOVERY SYSTEMS TO RECOVER MATERIALS THAT NEED NOT HAVE BEEN CONSUMED IN THE FIRST PLACE?

BECAUSE WE FEEL THAT SOURCE REDUCTION IS A VITAL COMPONENT OF ANY NEW FEDERAL LEGISLATION, WE WERE PLEASED TO SEE THE INCLUSION OF SOURCE REDUCTION PROVISIONS IN S. 3723, S. 3549, AND S. 3277. THE BEST APPROACH THAT CAN BE TAKEN AT THIS TIME TO ENCOURAGE A NATIONAL SOURCE REDUCTION PROGRAM WOULD BE THE PASSAGE OF PROVISIONS SUCH AS CONTAINED IN S. 3723 OR S. 3549. ALTHOUGH S. 3277 CALLS FOR PACKAGING GUIDELINES, WE FEEL THAT ANY LEGISLATION PASSED, TO HAVE AN IMPACT, WILL REQUIRE EPA REGULATORY AUTHORITY. SOURCE REDUCTION TECHNIQUES HAVE A BROADER APPLICATION THAN FOR PACKAGING ALONE. FOR EXAMPLE, INCREASED PRODUCT LIFETIME IS AN IMPORTANT SOURCE REDUCTION TECHNIQUE THAT WOULD NOT BE INCLUDED IN S. 3277.

THE NATION MUST MAKE A COMMITMENT TO REORIENTING OUR ENTIRE MATERIALS-USE CYCLE. ONLY THROUGH A STRONG FEDERAL PROGRAM WILL WE BE ABLE TO CONSERVE SCARECE ENERGY AND MATERIAL RESOURCES.